1d20, 2d10, 3d6?

[Quasqueton]

Has anyone here tried the 2d10 or 3d6 (suggested in UA) option in place of the 1d20? What was your experiences with it?

Even if you haven't used it, what do you think of the concept?

I'm thinking it could work fine and well with skill checks. Attacks and saves would be more affected by it because of the auto succeed and fail mechanic (and crit threats). But after seeing the dice rolls at my game table -- often very high or very low -- I think the 2d10 method could be a good idea.

Quasqueton

 

[FCWesel]

We tried the 3D6 methode last night and for me, the GM, it seemed....wrong somehow.

The main thing to me was that all the DCs and numbers were designed with a 1-20 count in mind. For example, a cleric had to make a Concentration roll of 15+spell level.

Well before he could roll 1-20, but now he can only get as high as a 18 (plus skill, obviously). Lets say that his rank in the skill is 3 (just for the sake of the discussion). The highest he can get now is 21, where as the highest he could roll before was 23.

I am not talking critcal and all that, but the basic fact that rolling 3D6 shorts a opportunity to get 2 points higher... So does that mean all the DCs should be lowered 2 points?

 

[jgsugden]

I think that 2d10 might be the 'best' option for a bell curve system, but it doesn't work with D&D 3.0 or 3.5. The game was designed for a d20, so all the changes change the balance of the game. They can't compensate for all those changes with a few pages of rules.

Although I like the idea, I think d20 is too engrained into the core system to just switch it out.

 

[The Souljourner]

I agree 100%. There are too many things that assume you have an equal chance of rolling a 1, 10, or 20. What about take 20? Would it be take 100 in the 2d10 model? Take 216 in the 3d6 model?

No no... it just doesn't work. Every bonus to a roll is dependant on the fact that +1 = +5% (pretty much). I like the fact that it makes an 18 in an ability way better than a 10, but the game wasn't designed that way. Suddenly, things like stuck doors will be essentially impossible to open. Traps would be impossible to find... DCs for everything would need to be recalculated.... yuck.

-The Souljourner

 

[apsuman]

When I first read about d20 some years ago, I immediately wondered why they did not go to a 2d10 system instead.

Mayfairs games had the DC heros RPG game and they used a 2d10 system. Rolling doubles allowed you to roll again and add the result. If you rolled doubles again, you could roll again and add the result. If at any time you roll a double 1 you automatically fail your roll.

This system allowed for some really really high totals. Roll a double 5, then roll a double 4, then roll a 6 and 5 and you have a 29. I thought that this system would do a great deal to account for crits and catastrophic failure/success.

 

[jessemock]

We're going to give the JAGS 4d6 (where 6s=0s) a try for skill checks outside of combat.

Combat may make some kind of d20 sense, but not so much for skills.

 

[Coredump]

We should make this topic a sticky......


MOST ROLLS ARE BINARY!!!

You either succeed or you fail. (criticals aside) If you need a 10 to hit, it makes NO DIFFERENCE if you roll a 10, or a 13, or a 17. Nor if you roll a 9 or a 7 or a 2. It is a yes or no answer.

you are not rolling a D20, you are rolling a simplified percentile roll. You have a 55% chance of hitting (10-20) and a 45% chance of missing (1-9). That is all. If you switch to 2d10 or 3d6, you have gone from a 20 sided percentile roll, to a 100 sided (or 216 sided) percentile roll. But it is *still* a percentile roll.

Now, you have two choices, you can make the percentage the same by changing the DC needed in order to keep the 55-45 chance, or you can change the game by keeping the DC and changing the likelihood of hitting.

The ONLY time using a bell curve would matter is when the die result can have multiple outcomes. Lets say that you are crafting something, and want to determine its worth. Then rolling 3d6 might be better than 1d20.


Almost ALL rolls in DnD are percentages, these are easiliy represented via d100, or d20 or d10 or whatever. To represent the same percentages via 2d10 or 3d6 takes a lot of math knowledge, for no benefit.

 

[da chicken]

What do you mean Coredump? You're either off-topic or you don't understand the concept of probability distributions...

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Changing from d20 to 2d10/3d6 is not something you should just drop lightly into a D&D game... in spite of what UA says. It will have dramatic and far reaching consequences on the game.