D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5]Change to spells cast from Staves...

[Celtavian]

Hey, I just read spells cast from staves now use the DC of the caster including any relevant feats. That is an awsome change. Now you can make super staves like wizards in books carry. Very nice change.

That is one thing I am noticing about this new edition. There are many small, not immediately noticeable changes that are very cool.

If this was in the previous edition, then you can laugh at me for being blind. I could've sworn staves used to have set DC's.

 

[Li Shenron]

Is there any cost and/or limit for applying metamagic feats to spells cast from staves? (Already there is a clear new rule that you can never apply the SAME metamagic twice on a spell)

eidt: sorry I think I misread your post, you meant only DC increasing feats? What about caster level?

 

[Fanog]

Yup, from what I read it is caster level and anything keyed to it (durations, etc.) Of course, all this provided that your own caster levels is higher that the staff's.

From the SRD:
"Staffs use the wielder’s ability score and relevant feats to set the DC for saves against their spells. Unlike with other sorts of magic items, the wielder can use his caster level when activating the power of a staff if it’s higher than the caster level of the staff.
This means that staffs are far more potent in the hands of a powerful spellcaster. Because they use the wielder’s ability score to set the save DC for the spell, spells from a staff are often harder to resist than ones from other magic items, which use the minimum ability score required to cast the spell. Not only are aspects of the spell dependant on caster level (range, duration, and so on) potentially higher, but spells from a staff are harder to dispel and have a better chance of overcoming a target’s spell resistance."

Enjoy.
Fanog

 

[Number47]

It isn't addressed how this will work with Use Magic Device, is it? Can I UMD to get a much higher caster level? Can I UMD for a much higher relevant stat? Can I UMD to fake having a DC-increasing feat? Can I do it all at the same time?

 

[cerberus2112]

It isn't addressed how this will work with Use Magic Device, is it? Can I UMD to get a much higher caster level? Can I UMD for a much higher relevant stat? Can I UMD to fake having a DC-increasing feat? Can I do it all at the same time?

Sure. Just set the DC high enough that a 50th level wizard can only be emulated by a 50th level rogue, and you are all set.

 

[Plane Sailing]

It isn't addressed how this will work with Use Magic Device, is it? Can I UMD to get a much higher caster level? Can I UMD for a much higher relevant stat? Can I UMD to fake having a DC-increasing feat? Can I do it all at the same time?

I would rule that UMD simply lets you use it with the base DC's. None of the things that you mention are named under UMD skill description, are they?

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Hmm, don`t you have to emulate caster level when using UMD on scrolls?

Mustrum Ridcully

 

[HeavyG]

It isn't addressed how this will work with Use Magic Device, is it? Can I UMD to get a much higher caster level? Can I UMD for a much higher relevant stat? Can I UMD to fake having a DC-increasing feat? Can I do it all at the same time?

All UMD will let you do is fool the item into working for you. You don't get any other benefit like actual caster levels, higher stats or feats.

For example, you can use UMD to emulate undead turning ability if you are trying to use a magical item which requires it to function, but if the item actually requires you to spend a turning attempt, you're screwed. You also can't actually turn undead. In the same way, you could emulate a high caster level to activate the staff but you don't actually have caster levels to use so the staff will use its own caster level.

That is how I would rule it, anyway.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

I just don't get why wands weren't upgraded as well. The only one spell and 4th level limit are more than enough reason for the 7 level disparity. There is no need to make them weaker still.

 

[bret]

It isn't addressed how this will work with Use Magic Device, is it? Can I UMD to get a much higher caster level? Can I UMD for a much higher relevant stat? Can I UMD to fake having a DC-increasing feat? Can I do it all at the same time?

Tricky question, I can make arguments either way.

They list the difficulty in activating wands and scrolls with the UMD skill. Some would argue that since staff isn't listed, you can't do it. I don't happen to agree, but I can forsee someone making that argument.

I would say that you would be trying to 'Emulate a Class Feature', namely the Caster Level. You can also attempt to Emulate an Ability Score. One could argue that for a staff, you would have to make both checks: one to find your caster level and the other to find your ability score.

On the other hand, the Emulate Class Feature doesn't allow you to use that class feature. You don't have a caster level, you just fool the item into doing all the work. Since it is a function of the users ability to cast spells and the rogue presumably can't do that, I could see ruling that the emulated caster level isn't sufficient to actually improve the effects over what the base item has. The rogue would always be limited to base caster level and their own attribute modifier in this case.

Personally, I think that I would rule that you need the attribute or class feature to use it in place of the default staff setting.