D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5] Sacred Fist

[Viktyr Gehrig]

A character type I have tried to play repeatedly is the Monk/Paladin/Sacred Fist. In Dragon #310, there's a variant Monk archetype that makes this even more playable-- however, there's a serious problem with the Sacred Fist prestige class: it has a class ability to bypass Damage Reduction, similar to a Monk's, but operates on a different scale than the original 3.0 Monk.

Do you have any reccomendations about how the Sacred Fist's Puissant Fists class ability would work? I'm thinking it should include magic and adamantine, as the Monk, and the player's choice of Good or Evil, since Sacred Fists are not necessarily Lawful, but do have, at later levels, a few Sacred/Profane bonuses; however, I'm not sure at which levels this is appropriate.

Also, should the character's Sacred Fist class levels stack with Monk levels for unarmed damage, especially since the two use a similar chart?

 

[jlhorner1974]

Sacred Fist is one of my favorite classes.

Yes, I think Puissant Fists should be changed to a monk-like bypassing of DR.

Without DotF in front of me, I would say DR/magic at 1st level, DR/good or evil at 5th and DR/adamantine at 9th level.

As for unarmed damage, Sacred Fist had its own chart, and monks didn't have much reason to take the class.

Now, I would say, go ahead and let the levels stack with Monk for purposes of unarmed damage only.

Since the class allows the flurry ability, you might also add a class ability to reduce the flurry penalty from -2 to -1 like the new 3.5 Monk ability at 5th level. I probably would not give them the extra attack that Monks get at 9th level though.

What do you think?

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

The reason I mentioned allowing it to stack is that Monk and Sacred Fist use more or less the same chart for Unarmed Damage. They gain increases within a level or two.

As for Flurry, I am inclined to agree with you. This makes it balance better with the Monk, who has a better Flurry but less BAB. I had originally allowed the levels to stack, but your solution is better.

 

[jlhorner1974]

I misspoke a little.

The Monk reduces the flurry penalty to -1 at Level 5, and to 0 at Level 9. Then a second extra attack is given at Level 11. I suggest you use the first two, and not give the second extra attack that the monk has.

So I would reduce the flurry penalty to -1 at level 5, and to 0 at level 9.

I said before that I would give DR/magic at 1st level, DR/good or evil at 5th and DR/adamantine at 9th level, and after checking my books, this looks good to me.


Jason.

 

[Brian Gibbons]

For ki strike purposes, I'd suggest DR/cold iron instead of DR/adamantine at 9th. That differentiates sacred fists from monks and is in line with the 'sacred' part (cold iron being necessary against demons).

 

[jlhorner1974]

Cold Iron? Great idea, excellent... I am SO stealing this...

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

For ki strike purposes, I'd suggest DR/cold iron instead of DR/adamantine at 9th. That differentiates sacred fists from monks and is in line with the 'sacred' part (cold iron being necessary against demons).

Problem is, a Chaotic Sacred Fist might be more inclined against Devils (requiring silver), or an Evil one against Celestials (which don't, IIRC, have material requirements). I agree that being anti-Construct and anti-object makes more sense for the Monk, though.

Perhaps the choice of silver or cold iron at 9th? Or just leave them with Magic and Good/Evil-- leaving their unarmed damage and enhancement-boosting Wisdom to punch through?

 

[Zack2216]

For the no shadow blows ability, what if that bonus damage from wisdom could eventually bypass different DR types? Like, once you have 20 wis, you can bypass ademantine, and once you hit 30 wis, you could bypass epic DR.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

For the no shadow blows ability, what if that bonus damage from wisdom could eventually bypass different DR types? Like, once you have 20 wis, you can bypass ademantine, and once you hit 30 wis, you could bypass epic DR.

You'd automatically bypass Epic at 22 Wisdom. And, I see merit in keeping enhancement bonuses separate from materials for DR, even when we're talking special "materials" in your hands.

 

[jlhorner1974]

Why would you automatically bypass Epic at 22 Wisdom?