D&D 3E/3.5 3.5 Soulknife - Does it need a power point reserve?

[Mark Hope]

Apologies if this has been covered - couldn't see a thread on the topic.

The 3.0 prestige class version of the soulknife needed to maintain a power point reserve in order to manifest its mind blade. There does not seem to be any such requirement for the 3.5 base class version - the text that referred to a power point reserve is missing from the base class.

However, the 3.5 soulknife's Wild Talent class feature notes: "This class feature provides the character with the psionic power he needs to materialize his mind blade, if he has no power points otherwise."

Is this extraneous text? It seems to me that it should have been cut from the class description and is merely a holdover from the 3.0 version of the class.

What do you folks think?

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Yes, it's extraneous text.

("Wild Talent" itself isn't extraneous. The soulknife really needs to be designated a "psionic character" to be effective.)

 

[Mark Hope]

Yes, it's extraneous text.

("Wild Talent" itself isn't extraneous. The soulknife really needs to be designated a "psionic character" to be effective.)

Cool - as I suspected. Thank you for the fast reply!

 

[irdeggman]

No it is required to have a pp rreserve to manifest the mindblade just as the text says.

The SRD has the text and the SRD specifically contains no "color" text so it should be defaultly viewed as "requirement" and not "color".

There are racial substitution levels that drop wild talent because the race already has a pp reserve - see kalashtar soulknife from Races of Eberron..

 

[Jeff Wilder]

No it is required to have a pp rreserve to manifest the mindblade just as the text says.

No, if it were required, it would be in the Mind Blade text.

It's almost irrelevant, really, but that text could be removed and it would make no difference.

Can the Soulknife manifest a mind-blade with no PP reserve? i dunno, let's check the text of the Mind Blade ability. No requirement for a PP reserve, so yep.

 

[Mark Hope]

No it is required to have a pp rreserve to manifest the mindblade just as the text says.

If that is the case, why is there no mention of this under the mind blade class feature anymore? It was there in 3.0 but is missing in 3.5?

The SRD has the text and the SRD specifically contains no "color" text so it should be defaultly viewed as "requirement" and not "color".

I don't think that it's colour text. I think that it's text that should have been removed in the revision to 3.5 and accidentally got left in. Either that, or the reference to power point reserve was erroneously deleted from the mind blade entry.

Whatever the case, the mind blade entry and the Wild Talent entry don't match up. The latter suggests that a power point reserve is needed, but the former lacks the appropriate text.

Hence my confusion

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

This is another example of people asking for a level of linguistic and organizational precision in game design that I simply see no evidence for expecting.

I can understand thinking that if its a requirement, it should be listed in the Mind Blade section of the class description...

But on the other hand, there was just a big thread that discussed the use of XP to create magic items. In it, it was pointed out that you can't lose levels due to sacrificing XP for item crafting purposes. The language that makes it clear isn't in the DMG, though, its in the PHB- IOW, not just in a different section, but a completely different book.

The quoted language in the Soulknife's entry says the class needs PP to manifest a Mind Blade. Even though its misplaced that's good enough for me, especially in the light of the aforementioned racial substitution levels that exist that replace Wild Talent when the race already has a PP reserve.

 

[Corsair]

It doesn't say it needs a reserve though. I read it merely as meaning that the Soulknife needs to be a psionic character. Without any source of PPs (Wild Talent, psionic race, or psionic class) it isn't a psionic character.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

It doesn't say it needs a reserve though.

But its strongly implied.

"This class feature provides the character with the psionic power he needs to materialize his mind blade, if he has no power points otherwise."

The first clause of the sentence could easily be interpreted as you say- that the PC needs to be a psionically active being to have a Mind Blade. However, that last clause, IMHO, tilts the balance in favor of requiring the character to have at least 1PP to manifest the blade.

 

[irdeggman]

Just to aid in the discussion.

From Races of Eberron - Kalashtar soulknife racial substitutin level (pg 125)

"This substitution feature replaces the standard soulknife's free Wild Talent feat. Since all Kalashtar gain power points for free, the character does not need this feat to matierialize his mind blade."

I think the text here pushes over the "intent" of the Wild Talent feat text for the souldknife class.

Remembering of course that Eberron was written for 3.5 and that it has an inherent psionic flavor.