D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5] Threat ranges no longer stack!

[green slime]

Staffan is completely correct. This change is totally incomprehensible. I'd have better understood a removal of Criticals altogether, rather than this monstrosity. This puts things so out of whack. I wonder what they though was a balancing factor to this?

 

[Dakhran the Dark]

One question: has everyone houseruled rapier, all of the sudden? I seem to remember that rapier was a Piercing weapon, and keen only works on Slashing weapons...

Still, I've never really had a problem with high-threat weapons IMC. Most of the scimitars and falchions they've seen were in the hands of the enemy (yuan'ti). I'm probably not going to implement this change in the way they intend -- I'm on board with differentiating the threat increase types, for example the "keen" effect vs. a "competence" increase. Like bonuses won't stack, but if someone grabs a keen weapon and happens to have spent a feat on Improved Critical, I'm not about to penalize them.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

Staffan is completely correct. This change is totally incomprehensible. I'd have better understood a removal of Criticals altogether, rather than this monstrosity. This puts things so out of whack. I wonder what they though was a balancing factor to this?

If the quotes are to beleived as the reason, then balance had nothing to do with it. They basically just though frequent crits weren't cool.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

It's not abuse. It's not a particularly good strategy.

yes but when its a keen, improved crit, spirited charge, rhino hide, assasins sense, weapon master, heavy, beer battered, chicken finger like, hold the coleslaw falchion then by golly its abuse.

 

[Dimwhit]

quote:
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Originally posted by Mike Sullivan


It's not abuse. It's not a particularly good strategy.
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yes but when its a keen, improved crit, spirited charge, rhino hide, assasins sense, weapon master, heavy, beer battered, chicken finger like, hold the coleslaw falchion then by golly its abuse.

And perhaps 'abuse' wasn't the best word to use for what I was trying to say, though Shard O'Glase is correct. I probably should have said 'exploit.'

One question: has everyone houseruled rapier, all of the sudden? I seem to remember that rapier was a Piercing weapon, and keen only works on Slashing weapons...

Actually, I think Keen was errata'd to include piercing weapons.

 

[Mike Sullivan]

yes but when its a keen, improved crit, spirited charge, rhino hide, assasins sense, weapon master, heavy, beer battered, chicken finger like, hold the coleslaw falchion then by golly its abuse.

Yeah, but that's "core," "core," "not-core," "not-core," "not-even-WotC," "not-core," "not-core," "food-modifier," "food-item."

I mean, seriously, if people are using four non-core and one non-WotC effects:

1. Okay, it's maybe abuse, but it's sure as hell not as much abuse as you could get for another seven-item combo that has four non-core and one non-WotC element.

2. Does anyone seriously think that a ruling in 3.5 is going to affect people who are set up like that?

3. This ruling actually doesn't even help. As I mentioned upthread, keen is broadly speaking a bad weapon enhancement. The +1 to hit and damage is usually going to end up doing more for you. So now we'll have people dropping keen from the above equation, and doing more damage.

4. Seriously, could we do away with rhino hide instead of crit stacking?

5. When are people going to grasp that Weapon Master is far, far, far better for scythes/picks than for falchions/scimitars?

 

[Murrdox]

One question: has everyone houseruled rapier, all of the sudden? I seem to remember that rapier was a Piercing weapon, and keen only works on Slashing weapons...

It's been errated that "Keen" affects piercing and slashing weapons.

In Magic of Faerun, "Impacting" was introduced, which is the same as "Keen", only for bludgeoning weapons.

 

[Ravellion]

I don't care either way. It matters incredibly little to me. All it will do is speed up the game slightly (less rolls). I'll run with it because it makes me have one house rule less.

Rav

 

[coyote6]

Yeah, but that's "core," "core," "not-core," "not-core," "not-even-WotC," "not-core," "not-core," "food-modifier," "food-item."

FWIW, Spirited Charge is core (PH, feat), and so is rhino hide (DMG, Specific Magic Armors).

I think if they said that rhino hide didn't work while mounted, or that "double damage while charging" effects didn't stack, they'd be fine. And assassin's senses is pretty whacked. And Improved Critical and keen not stacking is pretty whacked, assuming that means that a guy with Improved Critical with his keen weapon has no benefit over his pals that only have one or the other ability.

 

[Dimwhit]

Don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but if Keen and Imp Crit doesn't stack, all that means now is that you can purchase a feat? Why take Imp Crit if, for some gold, you can have a Keen weapon? And you don't have to wait until you have a +8 base attack. As soon as you have the money, it's yours! (Assuming the DM let's you buy the weapon or get it enchanted.)

I guess my fighter with the keen weapon gets to pick a new feat when 3.5 comes out. I'm finding there will be a lot of that. Good thing we have all these helpful changes.