3.ER -- Manyshot? !

[BryonD]

Yeah, I think it is plenty fair against Rapid Shot.

Compare to Archers with +6 BAB.

Rapid Shot gives 3 attacks at +4/+4/-1.
Manyshot gives 1 double attack at +2 and you can still move.

So you give up an attack and reduce your attack roll and limit your attack to a single target within 30 feet, in exchange for the ability to move.

That doesn't strike me as to much for a feat.

Does point blank shot count as precision based? I think it would. So that means you also lose 1 point of damage on every arrow other than the first.

 

[Quinn]

What's interesting is that they modified the penalty for Manyshot. I wonder what other modifications will be made to existing feats. Perhaps come this summer all that talk about Rapid Shot will be moot!

 

[DonAdam]

I would raise the same argument against this that Monte brought up against Rapid Shot on his messageboards today:

AC doesn't scale as much as Attack Bonus does with level. Those penalties become increasingly insignificant at higher levels, especially since they get cheaper after the first.

At high levels you can basically get a full attack and move. Bad, bad idea.

However, I don't think you can use it as written with shot on the run. Remember that it's a standard action, and shot on the run doesn't let you take a standard action between moves.

 

[BryonD]

At high levels you can basically get a full attack and move. Bad, bad idea.

Yeah, but the higher your level, the higher the penalty.

It is a strong feat. But you don't really get a full attack. You get the same number of attacks as a full attack, but they must be at one target and that target must be within 30 feet and you get a penalty to the attack.

Also, Rapid Shot is a prereq, and you can't use it at the same time, so that adds a very small indirect cost.

Compare it straight up to Rapid Shot and I just don't think it is significantly better.

Granted, a good arguement can be made that Rapid Shot is already to good, so just being comparable to Rapid Shot doesn't establish much.....

 

[Kai Lord]

The real question is whether or not the new Manyshot will be compatible with the new Shot on the Run. Even though Manyshot just oozes style, mechanically more often than not it would be more prudent to just use standard multiple attacks based on your BAB.

Severe range limitation for an archer, bigger attack penalties than using iterative attacks (which would all have the potential to deal out critical damage), and you have to blow a feat to use it.

Will my characer take it? Hell yes, but I really don't see what the fuss is about.

 

[Hypersmurf]

[coughBowOfTrueArrowscough]

-Hyp.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

Think of Manyshot as a feat that allows you additional damage dice to an attack (kind of like a sneak attack). Remember, it's all on one die roll.

If they'd worded it as (for a longbow): For a penalty of -4 to the attack roll, you may add an additional 1d8 damage to your attack (plus magical bonuses) as a standard action, plus an additional 1d8 for each additional +5 BAB with an additional -2 to the attack (or words to that effect) -- would you consider it balanced?

I'd say yes -- Rapid shot still provides a slightly better advantage (since you can engage multiple targets at less of a penalty, increasing your chances that at least one shot will hit).

Shoot, this is essentially the same mechanic many folks have used when house-ruling in a Called Shot feat.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If they'd worded it as (for a longbow): For a penalty of -4 to the attack roll, you may add an additional 1d8 damage to your attack (plus magical bonuses) as a standard action, plus an additional 1d8 for each additional +5 BAB with an additional -2 to the attack (or words to that effect) -- would you consider it balanced?[/B]

Plus Strength bonuses, plus elemental damages...

-Hyp.

 

[Kai Lord]

[coughBowOfTrueArrowscough]

So a stupid non-core magic item just got stupider. Your point?

 

[bret]

The Dex requirement, of course, is rarely going to be an issue.

Very, very few level 6+ Archery specialists will have a Dex less than 17 anyway...

Unless you are using the point buy system with 30 or less points.

You would need a 16 or better Dex to start in order to get to 17 by 6th level. It is certainly possible, easy for races that give a Dex boost, but the lower the point buy the harder it becomes.

The difference between a 14 and a 16 would have allowed you to buy another ability score up by four points (assuming it would still be less than 14). This is going to limit the number of people that have a 17 Dex at moderate levels.