3.x like a video game?

[buzzard]

I've seen this criticism offered by many in discussions over versions of D&D. However I've just deep sixed much of a weekend playing Neverwinter Nights. It's a good game, and reputedly the most D&D like computer game out there (heck, it does use the rules after all). However it doesn't really play like D&D. It plays a lot more like other video games than like a tabletop game. I can understand the design decisions that lead to this by the programmers. However it definitely shows me that the ruleset of 3.x doesn't really make for a videogame feel (IMHO) if a videogame based on it doesn't feel anything like a normal game.

buzzard

 

[diaglo]

NWN just SuXX0rs.


try the patched version of ToEE. and you will definitely understand why people say 3.11ed for workgroups is too videogamey.

 

[Ahrimon]

Playstyle wise they are completely different.

NWN was designed to allow for easy multiplayer gaming. Each person only controls one character. This translates to a constant time flow for combat and such. Behind the scenes there are rounds so that when you do something it will start on the next "round". But if you don't do anything in combat then you'll just keep attacking.

ToEE was designed to be a party based single player game. Story line and gameplay continues until combat begins. Then the game switches to a true DnD turn based combat where one person controls the entire party.

ToEE definately sticks closer to the rules than NWN. But both have thier place. One other destinction is that NWN is 3.0 while ToEE is 3.5.

Ahrimon

 

[Mordane76]

I've seen this criticism offered by many in discussions over versions of D&D. However I've just deep sixed much of a weekend playing Neverwinter Nights. It's a good game, and reputedly the most D&D like computer game out there (heck, it does use the rules after all). However it doesn't really play like D&D. It plays a lot more like other video games than like a tabletop game. I can understand the design decisions that lead to this by the programmers. However it definitely shows me that the ruleset of 3.x doesn't really make for a videogame feel (IMHO) if a videogame based on it doesn't feel anything like a normal game.

buzzard

IMO, 3.X Edition D&D has some video-game like elements to it, much more than the previous Edition did. However, I think this is because WotC knew what they were doing -- these elements appeal to the present youth audience for such product. Leveling is standardized and on a whole a good bit faster -- this is promote a sense of accomplishment, and has to continue at a fairly steady pace to keep interest (just like development in a video game). Healing and revival magic is, IMO, much more readily available in this edition of D&D than in the last edition, which lessens the impact of combat and potential character death, which parallels the concept of a "Save and Reset" mentality in video games.

Is this a complaint against D&D? No - if I don't like it, I can change it, and I do. However, this is my observation of the standard rules. Overall, though, these changes are probably for the best; they've drawn new people into the hobby, and with the introduction of new source materials (and hence options)and the experience and guidance of experienced gamers, everything should turn out okay.

 

[buzzard]

I should have been more clear as to why I felt that NWN doesn't feel like D&D. It's not the realtime aspect. I consider that one of the design decisions required for the game to be multiplayer. That certainly changes how things work to a good extent (like many of the fudges that allow for archers to be useful, and the ability to interrupt spells). However it's the overall tone of the thing that feels much different. The ability to rest and heal up as if it were nothing, is a big change (maybe a necessary thing given the single player nature, but it still feels cheesy). Also the proliferation of artifact level magic items make me feel like I have a 12 year old munchkin as DM. The fact that I managed to kill off a 20th level wizard lich at 11th level really does make me question the D&D authenticity of the game.

buzzard

 

[Bards R Us]

Ironically enough, on Bioware's Neverwinter Nights boards, you often lots of people complaining that the DnD ruleset that the game is based on is too simple or convoluted for the electronic game format and is better suited for table-top. And that it would be better if Bioware had developed its own proprietary ruleset instead (which they are currently doing).

 

[Kae'Yoss]

NWN is IMO the nearest to real RPG experience as it gets with a computergame. I doubt you can get much nearer to real D&D. The only game where you don't play Pokemon with a whole party (wait for Icewind Gate 3 where the characters can only say their own name...). The only game that allowy you to play more than one Adventure (unless you can wait until the community has totally taken the game apart in order to make changes - and you don't mind having to re-install the game after each such "module"). The only where you can have a DM.

Of course there are problems, but they are not necessarily a problem of the game, but of the players. I like playing NWN, but when that Chapter 1 Server is joined by a level 40 Character with overhacked items, who then proceeds to kill all NPC's he can, fun goes down the drain. But when you find a server with decent settings (Level restrictions, enforcement of legal characters and item level restrictions), and maybe with a sensible DM or two, it's great fun.

The fact that rest won't take 8 hours is unavoidable, because this is a multiplayer game. I don't know whether people will play a game where you have to rest for 8 hours (or even several minutes) realtime.

As with god-like magical items: It's a can, not a must. Just like in real D&D.

 

[Moleculo]

What i want to know is why no one has made a D&D game based off of the final fantasy tactics engine. I mean they are nearly perfect for each other! Sniff, it'd be my dream come for real.

 

[diaglo]

better yet read this thread:

http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=74119

 

[Creamsteak]

What i want to know is why no one has made a D&D game based off of the final fantasy tactics engine. I mean they are nearly perfect for each other! Sniff, it'd be my dream come for real.

A dungeons and dragons game (tabletop) based on Final Fantasy Tactics, or a Dungeons and Dragons (video game) using a similar engine to FFT?

I've worked on one, and am being educated in how to do the other .

Sadly, I never quite was able to finish my FFTD20 project. The current document is 80 rather random pages out of the 320 count I originally estimated the document would take. Half the finished pages are just lists of information that needs to be filled out properly...

But, heres what I have got...

Use Save File As...
Link A
Link B

Here are some older preliminary versions. A few people have liked them more so because they put every class into a 20 level line-up.

Part 1
Part 2

End Hijack.