4E - 18 Months Later: Love it or hate it?

4E - love it or hate it?

  • Love it!

    Votes: 152 36.6%
  • Like it

    Votes: 78 18.8%
  • A mixed bag

    Votes: 54 13.0%
  • Dislike it

    Votes: 69 16.6%
  • Hate it!

    Votes: 42 10.1%
  • Meh, who cares?

    Votes: 20 4.8%

I put my vote pretty squarely in love it. Sometimes I miss some of the intricacies of d20 and there's some nagging (but not game breaking) flaws in the system. But all the 3E stuff was more interesting and fun when applied to world design rather than running a game, and the flaws are small and easily fixed.
 

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I love most of it, but there are some parts that I could do without.
The only things I don't like are 'powers', 'feats', and magic items that have powers.
I like everything else though.
 

I am somewhere between mixed and dislike. There are some elements that I prefer to 3e. However, there are enough mechanical elements and general philosophy that I dislike and keep me from wanting to play it.
 


I like it, but there are things that bother me. But the same goes for third edition, Castles & Crusades, and just about any RPG I enjoy.

I'm really looking forward to seeing what computer games are developed for it, since an rpg with the story and exploration of a Baldur's Gate game mixed with the combat of Final Fantasy Tactics would be heaven. :)
 


This is an interesting point - I'm glancing across at the cover of the Temple of Elemental Evil and it carries so much good baggage that I could forgive it's foibles as 80's era specific. However, referring to a more recent pair of adventures that we have in common - I believe "The Whispering Cairn" and the "Prince of Redhand" are absolute classics. Now while I know that the Age of Worms adventure Path and 3.x turned to mud for you from your excellent blog, I think even you would have to say how great these two adventures were - and not just from a DM/player's perspective either.

On the other hand, with 4e I'm really struggling to think of any instant classics. Is it just the style that I'm not jiving with? The official series has fallen flat for our group - it has been saved I think by DM skill rather than any overt inherent brilliance. We have found the official hooks to be a little flat in these adventures. I think though that this is the opposite experience to your group [perhaps the sans-mini approach has really invigorated some stale RPing muscles?].

I've had a thought about adventures. I'm going to start up a new thread about it... look for this discussion continuing there. :)

Cheers!
 

I voted love it even though I would prefer 3.5E with a proper character builder and monster builder. The reason I want 3.5E is that I like the variety in the magic etc... but that same variety makes it so difficult to create your own adventures and campaigns. I just don't have the time or inclination now.

4E has me simply because of its convenience and I love that more than I love the game itself. My players feel the same way.
 

I voted, "like it." I prefer it to 3e (as it did away with plenty of broken mechanics, randomness and fiddly details) but I feel like some of the magic (literally and figuratively) was lost in the transition. You needn't look any further than the host of insipid magical items that provide a once a day +x modifier to a skill/attack.

other warts:

rituals: too expensive, little gain (e.g. you can scry a location for 6 seconds for 1k gold...)

skill challenges: I've come to dread these. They just don't work as promised unless you put herculean efforts into their development (see Mike Mearls articles about designing skill challenges for examples)

monsters: padded with unnecessary HP...you can avoid the resultant grind with careful choice of monsters (and monster roles) but a DM shouldn't have to be a brilliant tactician to ensure speedy combat.

lethality: they went a little too far in their efforts to remove the unpleasant random deaths of 3.5e.

powers: we need a recharge mechanic and we need a little more to differentiate different types of magic/power sources. I don't mean in terms of effects (I think 4e does this nicely already...wizards and fighters do very different things) but in terms of how the abilities are employed. As the developers get more comfortable with the system we've seen progress on the latter with the primal polymorph mechanic, rages, vestiges and now "full disciplines" and psionic augmentation.

small ephemeral modifiers and conditions: between the marks, the withering bastard swords (and the like), the warlord bonuses, the monster auras, and the controllers' debuffs, battles often turn into endeavors in accounting.
 

Tried for over a year. decided it was not our groups preferred game nor were we the target audience. Currently playing 2e and Pathfinder and having a blast.

Voted dislike. There is nothing about RPGs that bothers me enough to evoke hate.

love,

malkav
 

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