D&D 4E 4E/5E Transition issues

[gideonpepys]

Accepting that 5E D&D is inevitable - and ignoring the debate about when it will come about - I have a concerns about the transition period that I thought I would raise.

Previously, when transferring to a new edition, groups were at liberty to continue with their campaigns and use materials from the old edition until they felt they were ready to port over. Given that WotC conitnue releasing material for the old edition right up to the wire this seems like a reasonable expectation.

My concern is that, with 4E being very reliant on the online builder, compendium, etc, groups will find it very difficult - if not impossible - to continue with their 4E campaigns if/when WotC suddenly ceases to support them. Players may no longer have access to the characters, or be able to level them up effectively.

As someone with a lot invested in a 4E campaign, which I anticipate may run for some years, I am quite unhappy at the prospect of the latest edition being given a comparatively short 'shelf-life', unless it is appropriately supported during a transition period which I fear - for marketing reasons - Wizards will not allow.

 

[delericho]

Two things:

WotC haven't announced 5e. Isn't it premature to be talking as if the transition is imminent?

WotC have never done an edition transition in a post-DDI world. There really is no way of knowing how they'll handle it - they might well draw a line until the 4e tools but otherwise leave them fully available for people to continue to use. Indeed, I for one would actually consider it an improvement if we didn't have to deal with a continual revisions creep.

Honestly, it's a little premature to think that the sky is falling. At least, until tomorrow...

 

[gideonpepys]

Please note my initial comment "and ignoring the debate about when it will come about".

I know wizards 'have never done an edition transition in a post-DDI world', as that is the topic of my thread.

The questions is 'how will groups cope with the transition, and do we think Wizards will provide ongoing support'?

 

[Iosue]

I was watching one of the youtube vids about the VT, and saw something very interesting. It appears that you can select what type of game you'll be playing: 4e, 3.5e, 2e, 1e, or other. Unfortunately the guy doing the video said he'd never looked at how it works for anything other than 4e. But it makes me think; with the new digital tools we may never see the total abandonment of an old edition again. Even if there's a new edition and no new material is made for 4e, they can still retain the 4e tools server and software, letting them keep old subscribers. Perhaps something like having a 4e-only sub, a 5e-only sub, and a premium 4e/5e sub.

 

[Dice4Hire]

A few options

1) WOTC will freeze the 4E DDI as it is at a certain point and 4E people will be free to use it forever. (While of course paying a subscription of some sort)

2) WOTC will discontinue using 4E DDI and groups are totally out of luck.

3) The group in question does not use DDI and it is all totally moot.


Basically this. The ball would totally be in WOTC's court about what they decide to do.

 

[Dice4Hire]

I was watching one of the youtube vids about the VT, and saw something very interesting. It appears that you can select what type of game you'll be playing: 4e, 3.5e, 2e, 1e, or other. Unfortunately the guy doing the video said he'd never looked at how it works for anything other than 4e. But it makes me think; with the new digital tools we may never see the total abandonment of an old edition again. Even if there's a new edition and no new material is made for 4e, they can still retain the 4e tools server and software, letting them keep old subscribers. Perhaps something like having a 4e-only sub, a 5e-only sub, and a premium 4e/5e sub.

I am pretty sure the 4E tools will not disappear, but will stop being updated. Taht seems the best way to have good revenue.

 

[pedr]

The VT doesn't really do rules to a great extent. If you're playing 4e it will note 'bloodied' and have an easy selection of 4e conditions but you can easily use it for other editions of D&D - or even other games.

The more pressing problem is the Character Builder. Of course it is entirely possible to create 4e characters without the Builder, and Hero Lab can provide an alternative - though you probably have to enter the power details manually.

What's interesting is that despite the - often well-founded - criticisms of DDI, both Character Builders have been successful to the point that it's entirely legitimate to wonder how easy 4e would be to play if they didn't exist.

I have something of a suspicion that WotC will do something which is less abrupt than a full 5e, though - given Mike Mearls' desire that WotC is known as a company that supports D&D whatever version you're playing - so they may well be planning something in response to these concerns.

 

[gideonpepys]

Relatively speaking, 4E has not been a success, because a large proportion people were able to continue playing the old edition. (Thanks in part to OGL and Pathfinder, but thanks also to the fact that a group could continue to play any old edition if they so chose, because nothing depended upon DDI in those days.)

But making and sustaining a character sheet in 4E is a tough job without the builder, and never before has a copy of your character sheet resided solely 'in the cloud'.

Won't Wizards be tempted to use this method (however unpopular it may be in the short term) of encouraging players to move to the new edition, and thus increase sales?

 

[Dice4Hire]

What's interesting is that despite the - often well-founded - criticisms of DDI, both Character Builders have been successful to the point that it's entirely legitimate to wonder how easy 4e would be to play if they didn't exist.
.

Personal experience: Easy.

 

[gideonpepys]

Personal experience: Easy.

We began playing 4E with hand-written character sheets, and it was straightforward enough in early heroic tier. But eventually, the plethora of interelated powers, abilities and feats became too much for some of my players.

I'd be interested to hear about how you manage it, Dice4Hire. Any tips?