D&D 4E 4e alchemy kinda stinks on toast. Give me something better!

[Redshirt]

I've been thinking about making Alchemy and Brew Potion all one feat. It doesn't make sense to me that my alchemist can't make potions.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

I prefer the alchemy and brew potion remains separate, but mainly for flavor reasons. I don't want my hedge druid making up clockwork bombs

On topic, there was a thread a while back here {that I haven't been able to find} that I really liked. The change they recommended was to treat alchemist items similar to the ammunition rules in Gamma World {i think.. or dead world, or.. I really don't know}

In short, you create a 'batch' of , say, Greek Fire. You can then use that in one or two different ways:

1) use once per encounter. This does not 'expend' the batch
2) 'gang fire' the batch and gain an at-will attack with the item for the duration of the encounter. This does expend the batch

With this rule you drastically decrease the cost and still allow the item to be used to really change an encounter.

My searching time has run out {gotta go to work!} or I would provide a link to the thread...

 

[SensoryThought]

Potions are not a feat as brew potion is a lvl 1 ritual. Artificers get ritual caster by default. If you have swapped out ritual caster for alchemy, well that's the way it goes.

I guess you could house rule that an alchemist can brew potions at 2 levels less or something (or pick up ritual caster). Considering this also allows making magic items, it is not that bad. Alternatively, you could come up with alchemistical versions of certain potions with a less magical flavor.

 

[Wednesday Boy]

On topic, there was a thread a while back here {that I haven't been able to find} that I really liked. The change they recommended was to treat alchemist items similar to the ammunition rules in Gamma World {i think.. or dead world, or.. I really don't know}

That's a really inventive idea. I love the concept of alchemical items but their consumable nature always seems like a waste of money to me. I like this solution.

 

[On Puget Sound]

I could go either of two directions. Either make alchemical items more over-the-top but unsafe to use, or keep their impact low but make them minor actions. Perhaps some of both.

 

[RangerWickett]

If you're willing to break the strict numbers economy of 4e, maybe take a cue from Warhammer 40k Rogue Trader. In it, you've got so much money that you don't buy a grenade. You buy "access to grenades forever." Thereafter, you have as many grenades as you'd ever need, limited by how many you can carry.

HP scales a lot, defenses scale even more, which make low-level alchemical items useless at high level. But if you make alchemist fire a "weapon," ranged thrown, with 1[w] equaling 1d6 fire, plus ongoing 5 fire, then you could charge a price of 10gp for normal alchemist fire, 500 gp for a +1 alchemist fire, etc. And then you get up to 10 uses per day.

 

[Blackjack]

Speaking as one of Piratecat's players with Alchemist: we're interested in improving not just the fire/bomb/grenades ones, but the helpful/healing ones as well.

In particular, we note that a level 3 Healing Poultice gives you +2 hp to a healing surge, and costs 30gp. The level 13 version gives you +6... and costs 650gp! This was one of the things that led us to wonder if someone else has a house rule that adds some sanity here.

 

[jodyjohnson]

I would go the Alchemy as a weapon/power route and make it an at-will option to buy rather than a Consumable item to use like Ryan said.

Based on existing At-will powers and require an upgrade at the Epic bump.

For healing relate it to existing Healing leader at-wills (usually as an extra effect).

 

[Wednesday Boy]

The Alchemist theme's starting feature is:

At the end of a short rest, you can create one alchemical item of your level or lower at no cost. You must know the formula for the item you create. You can have only one such item prepared at a time.

Maybe give that out for free?

 

[Piratecat]

In particular, we note that a level 3 Healing Poultice gives you +2 hp to a healing surge, and costs 30gp. The level 13 version gives you +6... and costs 650gp! This was one of the things that led us to wonder if someone else has a house rule that adds some sanity here.

IIRC, the lvl 28 version of the consumable healing poultice gives you a whopping +12 hit points to a healing surge... and costs 285,000 gp.

Think about that for a moment.

Bizarre.