4E Combat isn't like WoW, it's like Street Fighter.

[Andor]

Only if you can shoot the food.

Don't shoot the food.

Shots don't hurt other players. Yet.

 

[Silverblade The Ench]

Gauntlet?

"Valkyrie, 3.5 ed PrC paladin/barbarian, is about to die!"

Group enhancing tactics are brilliant in 4th ed.
"Force enhancers".
Folk really need to investigate them, as the possibilities are brilliant

* thinks of the gaming group pal goes to.....and the way it's depleting the heroic races so fast, the monsters may soon out number them!*

Not everyone is as well versed, as folk here!

 

[AllisterH]

Am I the only one that plays the japanese strategy RPGs like Disgaea and Final Fantasy Tactics?

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Am I the only one that plays the japanese strategy RPGs like Disgaea and Final Fantasy Tactics?

No, and yes 4E is a lot more like them on a very practical level than the other games mentioned.

Street Fighter is a crap comparison because in Street Fighter you have active defense, and indeed it's a huge part of the game. In 4E, like most SRPGs (FFT, Disgaea, etc. etc.), virtually all defense is passive or "interrupt"-type abilities (effectively reactive in virtually all cases) with active attacks used repeatedly.

The main difference is that most SRPGs track things a little more tightly than D&D 4E and encourage extensive consumable use, but practicality dictates 4E play a little differently. I guess it's hardly a surprise that a turn-based tactical RPG is similar to turn-based tactical RPGs though!

 

[N0Man]

Street Fighter is a crap comparison because in Street Fighter you have active defense, and indeed it's a huge part of the game. In 4E, like most SRPGs (FFT, Disgaea, etc. etc.), virtually all defense is passive or "interrupt"-type abilities (effectively reactive in virtually all cases) with active attacks used repeatedly.

Apparently it wasn't obvious that I made my original post in jest. I suppose that what I wanted to express that you can break down various game elements and draw comparisons to many number of games.

I don't think 4E is like Streetfighter, but I don't think it's really that much like WoW either, at least not anymore than WoW is like D&D.

 

[EATherrian]

Am I the only one that plays the japanese strategy RPGs like Disgaea and Final Fantasy Tactics?

I do too and agree that these games are the closest analogues for 4E.

 

[hamishspence]

Diablo and Diablo 2?

Diablo was what I played a long time back, and it was fun, the first computer game I played that gave a real dungeon-crawling feel. the fact that anyone could learn spells is reminiscent of 4th ed rituals (diablo required investment in the Magic stat)

Diablo 2 works differently but also has similarities (3 levels of armour, for example, in 4th ed. 3 levels of nearly every item, in D2)

while 4th ed is not a ripoff of either, does it play a bit more like them than 3rd ed used to?

 

[RabidBob]

But the marketing model and design of this game is to attract mmo players.

This can only be a good thing IMO. MMOs are a natural feeder for RPGs as most of them are fantasy based and have RPG mechanics. WotC's strategy in this regard is good for the hobby as a whole.

And I'd love to hear from anyhone who ever had a good role playing experience in an mmo.

MMOs are not RPGs. They use RPG mechanics for the most part but an RPG is a game where you ... wait for it ... role play. MMOs will never be RPGs due to the lack of mass market appeal of role playing. Even "role play servers" in EQ & WoW are failures due to differences in opinion of what is acceptable role play and the restrictive rules which are necessary to prevent grief play. MMOs have their place (clearly given their popularity) but comparisons with table top games are a bit pointless. Seeding of game mechanics is inevitable especially given the rapid maturing of the MMO market (love or hate WoW the mechanics are VERY deeply thought out by some very clever people).

 

[AllisterH]

Diablo was what I played a long time back, and it was fun, the first computer game I played that gave a real dungeon-crawling feel. the fact that anyone could learn spells is reminiscent of 4th ed rituals (diablo required investment in the Magic stat)

Diablo 2 works differently but also has similarities (3 levels of armour, for example, in 4th ed. 3 levels of nearly every item, in D2)

while 4th ed is not a ripoff of either, does it play a bit more like them than 3rd ed used to?

No it does not.

Once again, the closest analogue to 4E in terms of videogame genres is the japanese tactical RPGs like Disgaea and La Pucelle Tactics.

(and if you equte those with WoW and Diablo, prepare for a very angry response from SRPGS fans like myself )

 

[hamishspence]

I mean the combination play

In Diablo you could play as part of a party: rogue disarming traps, sorcerer blasting (carefully to avoid fellow players) fighter attacking. Different tactics for open areas as for narrow corridors.

Diablo 2 works in similar ways but a lot more options.

Obviously D&D as a turn based game will not feel quite the same.

When it comes to combat, I do think 4th ed might draw from computer games, and computer games draw from D&D. That doesn't make it a computer game clone, it means that the two genres both use interesting ideas.

I do think, however, that movement in 4th ed (shift, slide, forced movement, etc) combined with turn based rules make it more strategic than most real-time games.