D&D 4E 4e Devils

[Nifft]

At first, I didn't like the direction 4e was taking regarding Devils, because I already had a super-cool idea about their "place" in the multiverse. However, I got to thinking, and I think I can co-opt 4e's backstory.

In my world, Devils are the advocates of death. They hate life because it is inherently disorderly -- they much prefer mindless undead, who do what they're told.

So, I've decided which deity the Devils will have killed: the god of death. Also, by killing their lord, they have allowed the Undead to exist (since the guardian of that part of the natural order is now gone).

Thoughts on the implications?

Thanks, -- N

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

Maybe the Devils are keeping up appearances - they've killed Death, but they'v reanimated him as undead, and are pulling the strings while appearing to be his servants - "Weekend at Bernie's"-style.

 

[(contact)]

Maybe the Devils are keeping up appearances - they've killed Death, but they'v reanimated him as undead, and are pulling the strings while appearing to be his servants - "Weekend at Bernie's"-style.

^ That would be diabolical!

I like the concept, Nfft. One of the great things about "the way things really work" in a D&D world is that it can become a campaign reveal. For me as a player, those glimpses behind the curtain are better than a +4 falchion of appended ability descriptors.

The WotC vision for devils could be the starting place for a campaign arc-- the "truth" as it's believed by mortal scholars and the adventuring grapevine. Later, the immensity of the devils' schemes and perdifery (killing and re-animating the God of Death FTW!!!11) could be revealed.

Is, then, the Devils' ultimate goal to cause more death? If so, why? Other than satisfying their delicate aesthetic sensibilities, do enough dead things give the Devils some kind of power-up?

 

[Nifft]

One of the great things about "the way things really work" in a D&D world is that it can become a campaign reveal.

You've nailed exactly why I'm posting it here. Knowing a group's agenda is a powerful thing.

Is, then, the Devils' ultimate goal to cause more death? If so, why? Other than satisfying their delicate aesthetic sensibilities, do enough dead things give the Devils some kind of power-up?

Their goal is to create an absolute hierarchy of unquestioning obedience. They don't intend to kill everyone, it's just that people misbehave all the time (and must be punished -- sometimes with death), while zombies do exactly what they're told.

But ever since Devils killed the God of Death (and took his stuff), they do indeed benefit from death: they have worked out how to skim "soul energy" off of the souls of the dead. This is why raise dead doesn't restore you to your previous full potential. Diabolical!

Cheers, -- N

 

[Pbartender]

What if it's not even life that they're all pissed off about... What if it's free will, and causing death (and undeath) is simply the quickest easiest way to eliminate all the disorderly mess it results in.

This would give the opportunity for Devils to not necessarily want to kill everything... They might be perfectly happy leaving the Formians and the Modrons be, for example.

It would give opportunity for Devils to use other means of subjugating free will, including mundane and magical means of domination and mind control... It also gives credence to the iconic roles of demons as temptors and and their habit of entering into convoluted contracts with mortals.

 

[(contact)]

The only thing that doesn't feel right for me about the Devils desire to necromantize the whole Prime Material is while it feels crushingly Lawful, it doesn't quite feel Evil enoough.

What if part of the horror of undeath is that while the free will is lost, the soul remains present? That undeath not only crushes individuality and creates automatons, but the individual soul is tormented for the duration of its unlife?

 

[Radiating Gnome]

I like the idea of Devils as the enemies of free will, using any and every method at their disposal to eliminate free will -- including use mortal free will against them (by seducing them into abuses of free will that undermine the support for free will in mortal societies and amongst other deific power groups).

And I love the idea of the dead god of death being a weekend-at-bernies style puppet operated by devils.

Most lower level Devils would have no idea that the God of Death was dead anyway -- that would be a secret of the governing council of Devils. And there would have to be factions among those devils, maneuvering within the rules of their society into positions where they can control the God's actions.

If the god of death is dead, though, what effect does that have on the divine magic of his adherents? Is the source still there at all? Is it tainted? Is it easier or harder for the dead to be raised?

Divination magic might also be effected -- if the caster is trying to contact the dead deity with a commune spell (or something like it) does the spell work at all? Is it intercepted by a Devil?

Lots of fun stuff to think about there -- and a lot of it may inspire some stages of the campaign.

-j

 

[el-remmen]

In the mini-setting I created for the original 4 color to fantasy - the unique thing about humans (or in this case "mortals") is that they have freewill.

Angels always had to do good. Demons always had to do evil.

Just saying, this might help for an idea of why freewill disrupts the devil's view of a perfect universe - perhaps only the creators should have freewill - or perhaps even THEY do not have freewill.

 

[(contact)]

this might help for an idea of why freewill disrupts the devil's view of a perfect universe - perhaps only the creators should have freewill - or perhaps even THEY do not have freewill.

I like that. According to the initial design of the multiverse, only the Gods should have free will, and Devils see their job as putting things to rights.

Big campaign reveal #2: The Gods don't shut the Devils down because most of them agree. Religion, therefore, is ultimately the kinder gentler Diabolical agenda, perpetrated by the shiny happy opressors.

 

[Nifft]

Devils: "Free Will is the root of all evil. When we were granted free will, we rebelled, and look how that turned out! No, really, we're doing you a favor."

Cheers, -- N