4e Extravaganza Seminar (with Cover Pics)

Probably because every edition has all ready pushed out the Elf/dWarf book (not to mention 3pps), so it's a little old-hat. Put the new races first.

If the third book isn't Eladrin I'll have to hurt someone. (And for the love of Corellon, can they put some *male* Eladrin art in it when they get there? I'm tired of having to photoshop glowing eyes into every picture I might want to use as a character portrait for a male Eladrin character)

The thing that really gets me though is why the heck are these six months apart. God help you if your race is something they're not likely to do for a while, the edition will end before they get to you. >_>; Every three months would make more sense. It's not like they're so expensive you can only afford two a year.

As for the Astral... Are you kidding me? What could possibly be of interest in the Astral? It ain't all calmness and paradises, berk. Just because you get to other places from it don't mean there's nothing there, and not every god's realm is a happy cheerful place full of sunshine and joy like you Clueless like to think. Go tramping around Bane's realm and see how uninteresting you find it when he gets piked off about it. You think Arvandor's all nice and safe? Hah. There's plenty out there to interest a cutter, and to put him in the dead-book if he ain't careful.
 

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...do none of you remember what happened near the end of 3.5, with the system being way too freaking huge to be anything remotely resembling manageable if you used all the books?
My memory of the end of the 3.5e era, which corresponded to my 3.5e campaign reaching 13th level, was that some great books were released (Bo9S,PHB II), some interesting changes were being made (encounter-based abilities), and the serious problems problems that existed from the start were being (painfully) exposed (bonus stacking/re-calcing mid-combat, math issues, general cumbersomeness).

The issue is not with the company, it's with the model itself. There has to be a better way.
So the business model the industry leaders have used since the beginning of the industry is wrong. Possibly. Got any evidence of this, aside from a gut feeling?

on-topic: I just pre-ordered the DMG II. I hate to admit in, but I've never read Robin Laws... even though I'm a longtime proponent of the close relationship between 'RPG' and 'story'/fiction. I'm not too interested in the rest of the lineup --I'll wait for the reviews-- though I'll check out the Player's Strategy Guide just to see what it's all about.
 

...do none of you remember what happened near the end of 3.5, with the system being way too freaking huge to be anything remotely resembling manageable if you used all the books? And I'm just talking about what WotC put out; bring in third party products, and... yeah, that'd be a freaking mess.

I was running 3.5e up to the end, and I owned the vast majority of non-setting-specific supplements, and allowed the use of most of them. Yet my problems on day 2,920 were the same as my problems on day 1, and they weren't with system bloat, but rather with the system.

I found that all those supplements added to the system and my game, not detracted from them. And I am finding the same with 4e supplements, except with far less problems with the system.

So, again, keep those supplements coming. As long as quality remains high, I have my debit card ready.
 

...huh. That does not match at all my understanding of how they were doing things.

You may be thinking of their limited release lines, where they plan on publishing a set number of books (generally 3-5, IIRC), and then they're done. Now, if the line does well, they can (and do!) add more books. Changeling and Scion, for example, have had extra books released (though not a lot -- not like Vampire); then there's Promethean, Geist, and I think one other that I'm forgetting (when I read the nWoD system, it didn't seem my taste, so I haven't kept up too much). The core of the nWoD system, though -- Vampire, Mage, Werewolf, and generic nWoD books -- have a steady stream of books released for them.

WotC, FWIW, is following that "handful and done" model -- with settings. Eberron, FR -- 3 books & done, further support through DDI. But for the core lines, both WotC and WW are publishing books, and plenty of them.

You know, I'm sure there are plenty of RPG designers and publishers who would like to find a model that is at least as successful as the supplement-of-the-month club model, and some of them are trying various things. I'm sure they can get tired of trying to come up with yet new Subject of the Month, or at least a new take on it. However, the fact that they're still using the supplement model seems to indicate that it is still the most successful model. People like having new stuff for their game (go to the messageboards of a popular but less prolific game, and check out the "when is the next book coming?" posts), though at some point it does become too much (the exact point varies by person, naturally).

If WotC did try the "3-5 books and done!" model with every game, then they would be releasing 2-3 new games every year. That would probably end up looking like D&D: Forgotten Realms version, D&D: Eberron version, D&D: Dark Sun version, D&D: Greyhawk version, D&D: An Island With Giant Apes version, and so forth -- each with mostly the same rules, with slight variations that would probably increase over time (as the rules evolved). They would continue to leverage the heck out of the D&D brand, because I'm pretty sure a well-known name like D&D would sell better than "Our Second Generic Fantasy RPG of 2012".

And can you imagine the howls of protest (buying the same rules, want more books, etc.) such a model would bring? Supercells would spontaneously form over message board server farms, generating tornados that would wreak havoc upon the earth, leaving broken lives and heartbroken orphans in their paths. And nobody wants that.

So really, WotC is thinking of the children.
 


Ok I look at the books and the only ones I'm likely to buy are Dark Sun and the PHB3, not a big supplement buyer and the crunch of the supplements I'll get through my DDI subscription anyway - so no problems there. Despite that I do like the line-up of products, if I could just throw money at DnD I'd be grabbing far more of the products.

What does bother me though is the DDM line up;
September 2009 PH Heroes Minis Series Two
November 2009 MM Minis Savage Encounters (large visible)
April 2010 MM Minis Streets of Shadow (huge visible?)
July 2010 MM Minis Lords of Madness (large visible)

There is a distinct lack of PC miniatures in that list - one hopes that they fall into the category of "unannounced" products that will be released anyway.
 



The one thing I'm worried about is that they call it "Players Handbook Races: ..."

What about genasi, drow, warforged, etc. who were not in a PH?

I want to see a warforged book.
 

The one thing I'm worried about is that they call it "Players Handbook Races: ..."

What about genasi, drow, warforged, etc. who were not in a PH?

I want to see a warforged book.

Well, there's a Genasi in the most recent batch of "Player's Handbook Heros", so I wouldn't put it past them to do it eventually.
 

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