D&D 4E 4E Liker - anything you worry about?

[gangrel767]

fears

Pretty much the only thing I am concerned with are the future of the abilities and powers. We have seen too many time (d20 modern), when a games comes out and the rules system rocks and then all of the sudden every [insert class name] is the same because there are only 3 powers to choose from. We need expansion powers as time goes on.

I am not one to create powers or let my PC's create powers (unless there is a good resource in the DMG or somewhere) because I always feel the are overpowered or underpowered... not quite the same as the published ones.

I suppose there is one other fear - my group has been disbanded for several years and there is no hope for it to reunite. I would love to run a game on D&DI, or play in a game and I fear that the interface will be lame and then they won't support it beyond the first year or so. (Is it worth 10 bucks a month?)

 

[2eBladeSinger]

So we will no longer have the starting-town NPC cleric who could heal PCs (among other things) beyond the PC cleric's ability (especially if the PCs are at a low level)?

Also, having adventurers as the only major divine casters around changes the setting much - in most previous D&D settings a typical town had an NPC cleric with respectable magical ability. If adventurers and monsters/villains are the only ones in the world with high-power magic this goes into the direction of a Supers game - not a bad genre by itself, but it isn't D&D.


I second that. Lance of Faith worries me - it's a magic missile with slightly lower average damage (1d8 instead of 2d4) and a small additional effect (making the target easier to hit). Sacred Flame is similar but adds in a minor healing effect. Cascade of Light goes in the same direction as well. Too many direct-damage spells for the cleric. This changes the D&D flavor significantly.

This also makes the cleric too similar to a wizard.

Not to mention that I haven't, thus far, seen any reference to spells like 'purify water' 'sanctuary' or 'bless water' I hope they are there... and do not require the cleric to make an attack roll first.

 

[Keenath]

So we will no longer have the starting-town NPC cleric who could heal PCs (among other things) beyond the PC cleric's ability (especially if the PCs are at a low level)?

I didn't say that. I said "we don't know the extent of what rituals can do".

However, I suspect the answer is "that's right", because most of your healing is going to be based on those Surges. You recover those every night, so you don't really need a local cleric so much as an innkeep. The priest can do what priests have always done -- lead the congregation in prayer, care for the needy, and engage heroes to deal with threats too big for the local militia.

Also, having adventurers as the only major divine casters around changes the setting much - in most previous D&D settings a typical town had an NPC cleric with respectable magical ability. If adventurers and monsters/villains are the only ones in the world with high-power magic this goes into the direction of a Supers game - not a bad genre by itself, but it isn't D&D.

The towns only had NPC clerics because of the necessity for PCs to go get healing from somewhere.

And once again, RITUALS. A commoner can have the Rituals feat and the necessary prereqs to use a number of healing powers -- from disease curing to poison neutralization to regenerating lost limbs. (I assume.) You don't need a Cleric-classed character to have a local priest with some pretty impressive powers -- it's just that those powers are based on these ten-minute or even hour-long rituals and just aren't up to firing out beams of holy light that burn zombies to ash.

 

[hong]

So we will no longer have the starting-town NPC cleric who could heal PCs (among other things) beyond the PC cleric's ability (especially if the PCs are at a low level)?

Good! Similarly, I hope we'll no longer have towns stocked with anonymous medical staff willing to cast raise dead on anybody who can stump up the 5000 gp.

 

[Shades of Green]

This changes most setting significantly - most of them feature a large number of NPC spellcasters, including clerics. So will 4E actually lower the level of magic in the typical D&D world while increasing the level of magic to the typical PC?

 

[hong]

This changes most setting significantly - most of them feature a large number of NPC spellcasters, including clerics. So will 4E actually lower the level of magic in the typical D&D world while increasing the level of magic to the typical PC?

It will most likely lower the level of magic available to people with blue circles around their feet, while keeping unchanged what's available to those with red circles around their feet.

 

[Simon Marks]

So will 4E actually lower the level of magic in the typical D&D world while increasing the level of magic to the typical PC?

I've seen nothing that suggests that 4e will increase the level of magic a typical PC has. In fact, the significant downplaying of Wizards means that actual magical power seems to have been reduced.

So, I'd say 4e has reduced the power of magic in the typical world overall.

Skill, however, and physical training has been increased in power.

 

[Shades of Green]

I've seen nothing that suggests that 4e will increase the level of magic a typical PC has. In fact, the significant downplaying of Wizards means that actual magical power seems to have been reduced.

So, if I understand this correctly, wizards use far weaker magic but use it far more frequently. Am I correct?

So, I'd say 4e has reduced the power of magic in the typical world overall.

Skill, however, and physical training has been increased in power.

I like that direction - 3E had a magic-bloat, especially magic-item bloat, the consequences of which weren't applied well enough to the average campaign world. Also, this focuses more on the character than on equipment, which is another good thing.

 

[Simon Marks]

So, if I understand this correctly, wizards use far weaker magic but use it far more frequently. Am I correct?

Sorta.

Combat magic seems to be weaker but more regular - non-combat magic is an unknown quantity at the moment.

Things like Fly and Invisibility being pushed way up the levels and reduced in potency are examples of Combat magic being reduced. However, the mysterious rituals could in theory have nay level of power and usability. Who knows...

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

New Fear: Morrus will play a test game, won't like it, and close the boards until all references to 4E have been removed from the database.

(Yes, you can file this under irrational fear.)

Morrus played the demo, and he liked it! My fear is resolved...