D&D 4E 4E: What we think we know

Keldryn said:
Even if there was a bit of misleading on the part of certain individuals from Wizards of the Coast, it's still way better than TSR under Lorraine "Gamers Are Not My Social Equals" Williams.

That argument never held much water with me. Bad things should not only be viewed relatively. If something's bad, it's bad, even if someone else did worse.

"I just stole 1000 Tacken from some idiot on the street, but I know a guy who stole 20.000, so I'm an angel" ? Nah :p
 

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I watched those youtube flicks where they talked about all the shiny new things. When they talked about the activation codes, they talked about the "E-Version" of the book.

Can we hope that "E-Version" means that for a "nominal fee" we not only get a web enhancement and the addition of the books feats and so on into the tables you can use with insider, but that we get the whole book as electronic version (i.e. PDF or something like it?).

Does this mean that Wizards stops selling the eBooks for the same price as their books MSRPs and instead make them available for a much lower price via that code?

If so, then I suddenly like the whole Insider part a whole lot better. It's not Paizo's "subscribe and you get your PDFs for free" but I'd be willing to shell out 5 bucks if that gives me a fully functional eBook of the paperware I just bought!
 

WoC is really the evil empire.
They destroy the old 3rd republic and build the new 4th empire.
Ohh but the lure of evil is ever great.
The easy way to power!
I love what I see in their previews even if I want to grumble and turn rebel.
But they have won me over, body and soul.

Count me in on the evil side. :]
 

Tharen the Damned said:
WoC is really the evil empire.
They destroy the old 3rd republic and build the new 4th empire.
Ohh but the lure of evil is ever great.
The easy way to power!
I love what I see in their previews even if I want to grumble and turn rebel.
But they have won me over, body and soul.

Count me in on the evil side. :]

4e - New Hope
5e - DM Strikes Back
6e - Return of the Thac0
 

So far, I am intrigued by what I have read.

First, there seems to be a focus on ease of play, and having distinctive characters. As I have been playing Dungeons and Dragons in one incarnation or another since 1980, I think that having each level matter to the character is a good incentive for players to keep on developing their characters. Also, as someone who at one time extensively played spell casters, it is good to hear that a spell caster will never entirely run out of magic. (Ah the memories of a 1st edition, 1st level magic user who shot off his sleep spell and is trying to be useful to his party.) Resource management is something I want to learn more about, as sometimes it is more dramatic for the party to move on to the next encounter than just camp out for the night because "we are out of spells, low on hit points, and we really want to stop the villain, but we will have to wait till morning."

Secondly, I am glad from reading ashockney's report on the front page that we will see WoTC drawing on the rich mythology and legends of the real world. Sometimes, as a DM and player, I felt that the rules tried to shoehorn a few things in that might not work with each world. (I have tended to use real world mythologies and cultures as inspirations in games. I would also hope that we see some rules where culture, in addition to race, can influence character development. So, perhaps a fighter from one human culture could be a bit different from another (perhaps by emphasizing some weapon/fighting styles) and an elven wizard from one elven culture could be very different from another elven wizard from a different culture. Hopefully, we will see 4th Edition being about options so that DMs can make the worlds that they wish, players can make the characters that they want, and all can have FUN. FUN should be the byword of a game.)

Also, I hope that the streamlining will allow some flexibility for players and DMS. So, if I want to have a character who is slightly different from the base assumptions, I can create one. Similarly, if I am running a game, I want to spend less prep time. (DMs will likely have more prep time, but a little less prep time is probably something that most DMs would love.)

Also, I am GLAD that it looks like epic level play is fixed. I consider the Epic Level Handbook a very mixed bag. Some parts were great, but a lot of it seemed to belong to another rule system. The spell system did not seem to flow logically from the rest of the magic system.

My hope is that the Digital Intiative will serve as a way to augment the rule books, and I want to hear more about it. I hope that it will have some labor saving tools for DMs and players.

Also, I think that keeping the OGL and SRD are good ideas. I have seen many great D20 products, and even run some games using Monte Cook's Arcana Evolved (I would love to see a 4th Edition version of this) and the Dungeons and Dragons core rules at EN World Game Days. I already combined the Hide and Move Silently Skills for the D&D characters, as Arcana Evolved did. Also, there are some great PDF publishers, like Creative Mountain Games, that offer good products to its customers.

It is my hope that WotC will communicate with its customers, and keep people informed. I have not gamed much in the last year or so, but I find myself wanting to learn more about 4th Edition. So far, I am cautiously optimistic. I just hope that we keep an open mind, and talk to each other, both as board members, as players and DMs, and as customers of game companies and game designers.

Okay, time to read more 4E threads. Thanks to everyoen who has contributed information, and their insights.
 

MerricB - from Scott Rouse on the WotC forums:

http://forums.gleemax.com/forumdisplay.php?f=686

There will not be any fee for use of the 4th Ed SRD / OGL period

Fee-based structure for d20 STL likely no longer going to happen, either, based upon the WotC / 3rd Party Publisher roundtable discussion.

SRD expected to be available in July 2008, with a possible limited early release to a select group of 3rd parties determined by WotC (not yet determined at this time).

Wizards will not be doing a 3.x to 4E conversion.
 

Not that I agree with you, but if you're thinking along these lines:
WoC is really the evil empire.

...then WotC is more like Darth Vader. Hasbro is the Emperor who is pulling the strings and making WotC make hard business decisions, though determining the precise methods of implementing those hard business decisions is WotC's chore.
 

EricNoah said:
I wonder if you could pay extra to get more activation keys -- like X dollars gets you a book and one key, plus buy more keys for a couple of bucks each. People are going to try to find a way around the system anyway, at least this way those who want to do it legit can do so without a book per player.

A book per player is ridiculous. Even a FEE per player is pretty hard to swallow.
I understand the idea that if I don't use the online tools, why should others have to subsidize it? But, supposing my party wants to use these online tools and everyone wants to use a laptop at the table for their character (admittedly unlikely, but hey, isn't that an aspect of this vision?), who is going to pay the 6x the online fee so everyone can access the player's handbook online? Is that me as a DM? Who is going to pay the 6x fee so splatbook X can be used?

It used to be that a DM could run the game and the players paid NOTHING but chips and drinks. Now, we're making players either pay that money or DMs pay multiple (7 times for a party of 6 on 7 different laptops) for the same information.

Shouldn't my players be able to say: Hey, I'm in a campaign being run by this DM. Populate my character creator with his books (or his books plus my books).
 

I think I'll just skip the online stuff entirely. I'm hardly a technophobe but for the most part computers are really not necessary for D&D.
 

I think it's pretty much impossible to force people to use the online tools. I also think that trying to charge a fee equivilent to an MMORPG to allow me to use an online character sheet and a paperdoll character image creator is... ambitious on their part. If I'm going to pay $10 a month for online fun it dammed well better be as good as WoW or CoH or something. Especially given that I can play Dungeon Runners for free, or Guild Wars for an upfront pricing model identical to old style D&D. A paperdoll does not qualify in my mind.

That having been said I do like a lot of the rest of what we're hearing. :)
 

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