Heh. A few comments!
Tyler posted:
If we assume that they don't spend too much time preparing those meals, or share duties, that's only about 3-4 hours out of an average hobbit's day. If we assume 4 hours of eating and 8 hours of sleeping, that's 12 hours of everything else. (Also, with how much they eat, and the fact that most of the hobbits we saw were as skinny as New York underwear models, they probably have the metabolism of gerbils).
Edena's comment:
Ah, but ...
Your typical hobbit likes his or her meals, and takes his or her time with them.
So, it's more like an hour per meal, plus preparation time!
With 6 meals a day, that's 6 hours plus about an hour's preparation (this assumes someone is working like crazy all the time, in order to prepare meals, of course!), or 7 hours total.
Now, hobbits like their sleep, also. Your typical adult human sleeps 9 hours a day, so it's reasonable to assume a hobbit sleeps 9 hours also.
That's 16 hours out of the day, right there.
That leaves only 8 hours for a hobbit to get up, get dressed, take care of the hobbit-hole, talk with his or her family and friends, and such things as that.
Did I mention work? Oh yes, there is only 8 hours a day (before subtracting the just above stuff) for work.
In order for a medieval society to function, it took 16 hour workdays out of everyone in the society.
16 hours a day, every day, from childhood to death at a very early age (say, 24 to 32.)
It took that much time, just to bring in a crop barely sufficient to keep everyone alive, assuming they ate 3 meals a day, and skimpily at that.
That, of course, assumed a good year - meaning the weather was good, and no wars were in progress, and the government wasn't particularly unreasonable.
Heh. Hobbits have the good life.
It is not a wonder that Sauron wants them squashed - he must envy the little rats!
Poor Sauron has to work 24 hours a day - does it not specifically say in the books that there is an Eye in the Dark Tower that does not sleep?
While Sauron slaves away, with no respect for his efforts and everyone hating him for putting order in people's lives, those rats in the Shire are frittering away their time in food and games.
Tyler posted
Judging by the looks of the Shire and Tolkien's intentions (the Hobbits were supposed to be English farmers), the hobbits were farming the best cropland in Middle Earth with tools similiar to those available to Europeans in the late 17th century- by then, cities were booming, and small farmers were able to make a decent living.
Edena's comment:
It was, indeed, prosperous farmland.
It had been the best farmland in the nation of Arthedain, apparently, before the Dunedain abandoned the area.
The hobbits, in other words, seized and held the best farmland around, and not sharing it with anyone else.
Sauron had a right to be offended. He was the rightful lord of Middle Earth - who were these guys to seize all that good farmland, and kill his orcs in the Battle of Greenfields?
Tyler posted:
That's not what I'm wondering... I'm wondering what in the heck all those dwarves eat!
Edena's comment:
They didn't.
All that stuff about the balrog was propaganda.
The real truth is all the dwarves of Khazad-Dum starved to death after Lothlorien refused to trade food with them (that is also the real reason why Queen Nimrodel of Lothlorien fled, when the vengeful dwarves came out after her and her people. But you never hear this, because the elves and dwarves are spouting propaganda to unite the rebel elements against the rightful rule of Sauron the Great.)
Tyler posted:
They're not bosom buddies, but they haven't fought a proper war with each other since the first age. Think of them like the French and the Germans today - they have cultural and political differences, and don't always get along, but they're allies nonetheless. After all, Elrond did invite the Dwarves to the council.
Edena's comment:
Actually, what happened is Thingol got greedy, and withheld the Nauglair from it's rightful owners, the dwarves.
The dwarves, on the other hand, got greedy and tried to take the Simaril from Thingol, to whom it rightly belong.
The Curse of Mandos came down on both Thingol and dwarves like a ton of bricks, and saw Thingol say stupid things, which prompted the dwarves to insanity.
This, of course, prompted the elves to their own insanity, which prompted the dwarves to a truly crazy insanity, which prompted the elves to their own truly crazy insanity.
Then, after all that, some OTHER elves came to Doriath, and killed everyone left, so that THEY could have the Simaril.
Morgoth, of course, sat back in Angband and laughed, and laughed, and laughed ...
Durin's Folk were not involved in the madness, nor caught in the Curse of Mandos.
They played no part in the destruction of Doriath or the massacre of the dwarves of Nogrod.
But King Thranduil of Mirkwood, 6000 years later, has to be PARANOID to the point of idiocy, do in Thorin and Company, and generally make a complete debacle of the Smaug affair.
It is not a wonder Gimli Son of GLOIN is so rude to Legolas (son of Thranduil) in the film.
And I suppose you think you're the one to do it?!
I'll be dead before I see the Ring in the hands of an elf!
Never trust an elf!
This, of course, is why Sauron's claim to rulership is legitimate.
Under Sauron, there would be peace between the races.
Under Sauron, none of this kind of paranoia and infighting, would be allowed.
Tyler posted:
Immortality as an orc ain't that great. And human mortality is a blessing- humans pass to the plains of Aman (if I remember right), where they await the end of the world when they shall be made as great as the Ainur and join them in their song. When the world ends, the Elves will just cease to exist- so much for immortality.
Edena's comment:
Actually, nobody knows what happens to the elves in the Second Music, except perhaps Mandos and Manwe, and they do not speak of it.
All the (stupid, rebel) Valar had to do was allow the Numenorians to go to Valinor, and see for themselves their own fate after death.
Not a big deal - you just board a ship, sail west, land in Valinor, hob-nob with your friends the elves, and see your forefathers lounging around in peace and grace.
But could the Valar do that? No .....
They gave the elves an invite to Valinor, pretty much as soon as they heard they had awakened, but can poor men go to Valinor? Nah ... it's too good for them.
The Rightful Lord of Middle Earth, Sauron, pointed this all out to the Numenorians, and launched a just war against this rebel Vala.
If the One had not interfered, the Numenorians would have conquered Valinor (even Tolkien says they were a real threat to Valinor!) and then the Atani would have had something to party about!
Under the just and reasonable rulership of Sauron the Great, of course.
As for the orcs, they would have gained their fair place in Middle Earth, and in Valinor, under the wise and thoughtful leadership of Sauron.
Never again would orcs be hunted down, forced into dark caves, besieged in mountain fortresses!
And then, immortality would be something orcs would want.
Life would be good.
Tyler posted:
Gandalf couldn't handle the power of the ring. The more powerful the being, the more likely they would be corrupted by it (except for Tom Bombadil, for reasons I couldn't remember). If Gandalf had took the ring, he would have failed in his mission and joined with Sauron and Saruman. Goodbye Middle-Earth.
Edena's comment:
Then why didn't the Valar send someone more competent to handle the situation?
Typical rebels. Can't even handle their own affairs, much less hope to competently run things.
When Saruman, their top man, realizes the light, and joins Sauron, they don't even send anyone to deal with him.
Typical incompetent rebels.
Now, if Orome the Hunter had come, and taken the Ring, I don't think Sauron could have stopped him from dunking it in the drink of Mount Doom.
However, as we all know, the rebel Valar are COWARDS.
That's the real truth.
They are afraid of Sauron the Great, and so instead of daring to take him on personally, they send expendables - and then they wonder why these lesser minions cannot handle the job.
The Valar know that if they show their faces in Middle Earth, Sauron is going to kick their butts. So poor Gandalf has to do a job meant for someone ten times his stature.
Tyler posted:
Yes, but was Saruman truly his superior in power, wisdom, and knowledge? Slightly, perhaps. I'd say Gandalf and Saruman were a pretty close match. (Also, the fact that the Elves favored Gandalf while the Men favored Saruman says a lot)
Well, of course Saruman was superior to Gandalf.
He could not have imprisoned Gandalf on Orthanc, otherwise.
And, of course, he choose the path of wisdom, and joined the winning side, knowing that Sauron was the true and rightful Lord of the Earth.
Gandalf, the loser, took the side of the rebel rabble of elves, who made a lot of noise but ultimately intended to flee to Valinor and the safety of the protection there.
Tyler wrote:
I got the impression that the Nazgul probably have a pretty slow Ethereal-net connection to Sauron, which was causing their reaction times to lag. But I could be wrong.
Edena's comment:
I think the Ringwraiths showed (gasp) mercy!
They had mercy on the rats, and let them live.
Maybe they believed the rats (er, hobbits) could be educated later to understand the truth, and come to believe in the rightful, just rule of Sauron the Great.
They had no mercy on Frodo, and after wounding him they walked away laughing.
But that was the right thing to do.
After all, this was the Thief of the One Ring, and he deserved less than a clean death for his crime.
After he passed into the Wraith-World, the Ringwraiths could take him to Sauron for a more just punishment.
Edena_of_Neith
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Footnote: I hope nobody took anything I said above seriously.
