6-8 Encounters a long rest is, actually, a pretty problematic idea.

[Satyrn]

Yeah, if you had a build that could spam Disintegrate every round how boring would that be! Set phasers on vaporize!

When I played Star Trek D20 several years ago, my klingon warrior had a disruptor at first level. So boring. I'm just glad that we were outlaws so I could roar my Klingon battlecries with a pirate voice.

"Yarr! T'is a gud day t' die!"

 

[Mistwell]

This.

Whenever the 6 to 8 number is bandied about, the implication is that sometimes you have few encounters, sometimes more.

But in reality, the game gives zero mandate to the DM and gives out plenty of "rest enabler" tools to players.

Unless you're fine with the whole "dragon eats princess in three days" time restriction (that virtually never happens in published modules) the grim reality is that a long string of easy encounters is a concept that is completely DOA.

The only way to challenge the player characters in practice is to create a single encounter that all by itself is a challenge.

That is, with NO assumption you're going to be able to make the party keep going while in the "red" of resources.

This, for well-built characters, means something many times the DMG definition of Deadly.

It also means the short-long class balance is an illusion.

In summary, what it means is, the encounter guidelines are a complete joke.

I have found what you just said to be false in practice, in my games. I have found many, MANY ways to challenge the player characters in practice where a single encounter all by itself is not a challenge, but only the accumulation of many encounters is the challenge, and the players for a variety of reasons don't take a bunch of rests in between those encounters. I am sorry you have not played games like that, but we have many times.

I have no issue believing you have had the experience you described.

I have a real issue with you declaring for everyone that there is only one way to challenge the players, and it's the way you've experienced. There is a major difference between, "Here is what I've found in the games I've played" and "Here is a universal truth for all games". The later is just plain false.

 

[Oofta]

When I played Star Trek D20 several years ago, my klingon warrior had a disruptor at first level. So boring. I'm just glad that we were outlaws so I could roar my Klingon battlecries with a pirate voice.

"Yarr! T'is a gud day t' die!"

Yeah. Those video games where all I do is run around shooting at the bad guys a gun while occasionally using limited resources like grenades or the almighty BFG are so boring. Total waste dozens if not hundreds of hours.

Of course I'm also one of those people that's perfectly happy with champion fighters now and then. Sometimes I just want to turn of that "thinking" part of my brain (what's left anyway) while figuring out who to smack next or if I can think of something punny to say.

Most 5E games I've been we've been able to vary pacing, difficulty and encounters to keep things interesting whether we had 3 fights between long rests or 10.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

So do any of the AP actually push this kind of resource management model? The two I have XP with had little to make this 6-8 per long rest a reality. There would be instances where it could be an issue but in general getting a long rest in was not a problem.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

I'd be happier with a resource system that didn't, when it was firing on all cylinders, force people to be stingy with their most exciting abilities and default to using seriously weak beer abilities.

Exciting abilities are exciting, at least in part, because you can't use them all the time. If you could cast cloudkill at will, then it would get old quickly. At-will abilities also set the baseline, compared to limited-use abilities. If limited-use abilities were less exciting than at-will abilities, then people wouldn't use them.

You say that you ran 4E games, starting at level 7, because players got bored of their at-will abilities - even though 4E at-will abilities were all more exciting than basic attacks in every previous edition. So you want a game where at-will abilities are a non-factor, and characters have enough limited-use abilities that they can get by on just those?

Because if that's the case, then I'm not sure it's ever going to work out for you. If characters had enough limited-use abilities that they never needed to use at-wills, then those limited-use abilities would effectively take the place of at-wills, in that they would quickly become the boring new baseline.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Yeah. Those video games where all I do is run around shooting at the bad guys a gun while occasionally using limited resources like grenades or the almighty BFG are so boring. Total waste dozens if not hundreds of hours.

Well, yeah, that's why "D&D (X)e is like a video game" is fight'n words.

 

[cooperjer]

So do any of the AP actually push this kind of resource management model? The two I have XP with had little to make this 6-8 per long rest a reality. There would be instances where it could be an issue but in general getting a long rest in was not a problem.

I've only run Red Hand of Doom, Princes of the Apocalypse, and Cat & Mouse, and Tomb of Tiberesh. Red Hand of Doom is a bit of a sandbox and made with 3.5 rules, so it's hard to judge from it. Princes of the Apocalypse has a lot of dungeon crawl. This allows characters to choose when to take a short or long rest if they can lock themselves in a room. The dungeons do have random encounter tables to roll on, but I like to take guidance from some on this forum and use NPCs as a way to increase risk. Thus there have been a few times I ignore the random encounter roll and have one anyway. In addition, the bard has Tiny Hut, which allows a long rest without interruption. This isn't to say NPCs walking through the dungeon don't notice the hut. In some cases they do notice the hut and make ambush arrangements for when something emerges from it. The Cat & Mouse adventure is for low levels (1 - 2) and takes place in several locations in a city. This allows characters to escape a bad situation, rest and try again. Tomb of Tiberesh (2-3) is a tomb raider style of adventure with little in the line of wandering monsters. Characters can rest just about anywhere. If I wanted to throw some wander monster beetles or other insects it would have been appropriate.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

Well, the point is why would any canny group of players create a set of characters that doesn't trivially take long rests whenever they feel like it.

Except that: “A character can't benefit from more than one long rest in a 24-hour period” so a canny DM can use that RAW to challenge the PCs.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I think the idea of chara ters being able to do 6 to 8 encounters a day is good.
As a DM you need to make encounters not too hard though. Try it out. Players often don't mind small and fast encounters where they use one big gun and win nearly trivially. If they feel powerful with at wills they won't complain.
In my experience it starts being annoying if you use too hard encounters in fast succession. If you don't see progress by using at wills it feels just bad.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

When I played Star Trek D20 several years ago, my klingon warrior had a disruptor at first level. So boring. I'm just glad that we were outlaws so I could roar my Klingon battlecries with a pirate voice.

"Yarr! T'is a gud day t' die!"

I can't help thinking this is kind of missing the whole point of Star Trek, which is to try and solve problems without killing anyone.