D&D 5E 7th Level Spells allow lots of minions!

[Gwarok]

Ok, so I have an NPC bard who's actually a main villain pretending to be one of the good guys, and he currently is 13th with access to the following: Magic Circle, Planar Binding, Conjure Elemental. If he casts the circle at 4th level it will last 2 hours, giving him the time needed to conjure an invisible stalker using Conjure Elemental at 6th, then use Planar Binding at 7th to bind it for 30 days. Game balance aside, is there any reason this guy wouldn't use any day he doesn't plan on adventuring to keep a posse of Invisible Stalkers at his disposal? He could theoretically keep up to 30 stalkers bound in such a way if he used this every day.

Also, being a bard, he'll soon have at 14th the ability to select Planar Ally. From what I've read Planar Ally lets you summon a much wider range of creatures, and in this case I was thinking of using it bind Slaadi in a similar way. They have TERRIBLE Charisma saves, even the Death Slaadi would be easily bindable assuming he can get the names of some to call up. Is there any reason this wouldn't work in terms of game mechanics?

 

[jaelis]

A creature summoned using conjure elemental will disappear after 1 hour, when the spell ends. It might still be bound to you for the duration of planar binding, but it won't be around to help.

Planar Ally is limited by the fact that the creature is sent by a god or other powerful entity. If you abuse the creature (like with planar binding), the powerful entity might get mad, and certainly might not be willing to keep sending more.

 

[Gwarok]

A creature summoned using conjure elemental will disappear after 1 hour, when the spell ends. It might still be bound to you for the duration of planar binding, but it won't be around to help.

Planar Ally is limited by the fact that the creature is sent by a god or other powerful entity. If you abuse the creature (like with planar binding), the powerful entity might get mad, and certainly might not be willing to keep sending more.

Well the description of Planar Binding specifically states that if the creatures was summoned or created using another spell, the duration of that spell is extended to match the duration of the binding. As far as the Planar Ally goes, that does stand to reason, although it's not like it says you need to be on good terms with the entity you're invoking, merely that it be known to you. Can't imagine Demon Princes and Dukes of Hell start off in a positive state of mind. Besides it's a 6th level spell, that's where they jump up in power and effects. Otherwise that means really the only way to summon and bind things past elementals is basically Gate, which seems to rule out anyone but archmages and the such dipping their toes in waters past CR6 creatures.

 

[jaelis]

Oh yes, it is, isn't it. Then I suppose that could work.

 

[CapnZapp]

The biggest factor hasn't even been brought up yet - he's a NPC.

He doesn't have to abide by the player character rules.

Heck, he doesn't even have to summon and bind his allies.

You could just give him allies. Then, if anyone asks how he did that, you say planar binding something something deal with the devil.

So no, there is no reason this wouldn't work. Most pertinently because it doesn't have to "work" - it can just be because you said so.

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[neogod22]

If you're the DM, and he's an NPC, you can make up any reason why he has allies including using spells and abilities PCs can't have.

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[jgsugden]

Rd 1: Cast Summon Elemental. Rd 2: Begin Casting Planar Binding. ... Rd 601 Summon Elemental ends and the elemental returns to their home plane. Rd 602, the Planar Binding is complete, but the elemental is no longer there and the spell fails. There is no extension of the duration of the summons before the binding is completed.

I don't think that was the intent, but it is, technically, how it plays out, AFAICT. Only a character with two levels of fighter (for Action Surge) can technically make use of this combo.

I allow this combo to work in my games.

 

[Gwarok]

The biggest factor hasn't even been brought up yet - he's a NPC.

He doesn't have to abide by the player character rules.

Heck, he doesn't even have to summon and bind his allies.

You could just give him allies. Then, if anyone asks how he did that, you say planar binding something something deal with the devil.

So no, there is no reason this wouldn't work. Most pertinently because it doesn't have to "work" - it can just be because you said so.

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That is certainly true, but I also have a PC in another campaign that will be doing likewise at some point. Part of the exercise is to play around with the game mechanics, and I've had a lot of fun doing somethings with NPCs with character levels. Made a 20th barbarian based on Orc Warlord stats that's a real humdinger of a melee death machine. Agrak the Untamed, Champion of Gruumsh weighs in at a hefty 325hp with a 24 STR and CON, resistant to all but psychic while raging don't hurt none either. Doesn't strictly follow the MM rules for adding character levels to a monster, but a fun exercise nonetheless.

 

[Gwarok]

Rd 1: Cast Summon Elemental. Rd 2: Begin Casting Planar Binding. ... Rd 601 Summon Elemental ends and the elemental returns to their home plane. Rd 602, the Planar Binding is complete, but the elemental is no longer there and the spell fails. There is no extension of the duration of the summons before the binding is completed.

I don't think that was the intent, but it is, technically, how it plays out, AFAICT. Only a character with two levels of fighter (for Action Surge) can technically make use of this combo.

I allow this combo to work in my games.

Yea, I ruled that they can work within the 1 hour. The fact binding has a 1 hour casting time and almost all summoning spells have that as their duration I've taken to mean they were meant that way. Also, I say a circle traps whatever you put in it for however long the circle lasts, assuming the creature fails it's CHA save to leave it. It's pretty tough to make it last for too long anyways, so I don't really see it as an issue campaign wise. When start splitting hairs over the exact to the second duration of things on out of combat stuff my gut just tells me I'm sucking the life out of the game.

 

[Croesus]

Rd 1: Cast Summon Elemental. Rd 2: Begin Casting Planar Binding. ... Rd 601 Summon Elemental ends and the elemental returns to their home plane. Rd 602, the Planar Binding is complete, but the elemental is no longer there and the spell fails. There is no extension of the duration of the summons before the binding is completed.

I don't think that was the intent, but it is, technically, how it plays out, AFAICT. Only a character with two levels of fighter (for Action Surge) can technically make use of this combo.

I allow this combo to work in my games.

Interesting. I hadn't notice the casting time problems. Good catch!

Another is cost. Each planar binding spell costs 1,000 gp to cast. So each bound creature will cost 1,000 gp per month, 12,000 gp per year. Having 30 of these creatures would cost 360,000 gp per year. Good luck with that.