8th Level Druid

DemonLoki

First Post
So my father in law is running a 3.5 campaign on the side of our eberron campaign in the normal greyhawk setting. We have the entire 3.5 collection of books (well over $2,000.00 worth of material) and he's not being restrictive on the rules... Basically we have a party of four that is going into an underground setting and he wants us to make lvl 8 characters. He has pretty much told us to try and min/max or we're not gonna survive... so I'm definately up for ideas. So far I'm looking at possibly a human druid who summons a lot with stuff like augment summoning... but I like the idea of natural spell and being able to wildshape and be effective when need be. The other members were looking at probably doing a wizard, an assassin/rogue type or fighter, and probably another rogue type... so it doesn't look like there will be a cleric haha... Feel free to give your suggestions, I don't really have much thought out YET... Figured probably a human for the extra feat, and a dire wolf as my animal companion. I figure I'll sit atop that with some evard's tentacles and blast away or unleash my summons
 

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1. Evard's Tentacles isn't a Druid spell. Maybe you were thinking of entangle?
2. In my experience, an animal companion with pounce and many natural attacks is the best for sheer combat power. Basically the wild cats line. Leopard, Lion, Tiger, Dire Lion, maybe Smilodon (sabre-toothed tiger, from Frostburn). Don't do Dire Tiger, though. I had a "cat lady" druid and discovered the benefits are kinda better if you just advance a regular tiger, unless you want to go for sheer HD. Which is useful, for things like Blasphemy spells and getting more feats... Back to the original point, Dire Wolf only gets one attack (two eventually, thanks to companion boosts) and a trip check on it. I'd rather have a pouncing Tiger making 5 attacks. Complete Mage has a variant rule to get a companion elemental instead, if you like.

3. Can you be more specific in what you'd like to do? Druid more than most other classes really has incredible room for growth in many directions.

If you want to focus on summoning, my friend made a pretty nasty Wizard/Druid/Arcane Heirophant (dual casting class, Races of the Wild). He used the Unearthed Arcana Conjuror variants to great effect, also found here: Specialist Wizard Variants :: d20srd.org
[sblock]Rapid Summoning is just plain worth it (note it only affects Summon Monster Spells, not Summon Nature's Ally). Enhanced Summoning is also worth it, giving you Augmented Summoning w/o the largely worthless Spell Focus feat. And if you want Scribe Scroll, you can just pay a normal feat for it, so you end up getting Augmented Summoning and Scribe Scroll w/ 2 feats instead of 3. The last variant might be worth it, up to you. This build will have lots of spells to play with, so it doesn't hurt too much.
Now you have Druid side for spontaneous summoning, and Wizard side for quick (standard action) summoning. Also check out Frostburn for Summon Ice Beast, they are quite strong. Choose a big strong melee brute like a brown bear for the ice beast. Complete Mage has a reserve feat to summon weak elementals at will, might want that to further your summoning pool.
If Dragon Compendium or the Dragon magazines are open, there are some VERY powerful feats for a dual caster, let me know if those are part of your "book" collection.
Back to Arcane Heirophant, the class merges your animal companion and familiar into one, bonuses largely stacking and bad stuff going away. For example, if it dies, you can summon a new one in 24 hours for no gold cost and no lost xp. Obviously, to make use of this, you would want Obtain Familiar feat if you chose Rapid Summoning. Class gives full dual casting, druid skills, AND stacks for wildshaping. Gives some other goodies, too.
Final note, as a summoner, in general it's nice to have someone like a bard to buff your "army," if possible. The effects can really be magnified if you have lots of beasties roaming about.[/sblock]

I was basically just describing what my friend did, sorry if it's too specific for what you want. Though that build mostly optimizes summoning and doesn't hurt your ability to blast terribly much, so it's pretty good.
 

Everything is game... All books, all magazines... He just wants us to go crazy and be creative. I think he said we're running Temple of Doom or something, and its a party of just four... so he said it's gonna be uber difficult. Also, I was looking at those wizard varients... and if you take conjurer it mentioned around rapid summoning that you give up the right to have a familiar, but then you later went on to talk about merging the animal companion WITH the familiar. If that varient gives up the familiar, where does it come back into play?
 

So my father in law is running a 3.5 campaign on the side of our eberron campaign in the normal greyhawk setting. We have the entire 3.5 collection of books (well over $2,000.00 worth of material) and he's not being restrictive on the rules...

Might I say your father-in-law is totally awesome? I rarely hear of DMs allowing that much for their games. I also own all the 3E material, including some outstanding d20 products, and the 3E Dragon Magazines and though it's challenging, it sure is a lot of fun. I understand why some DMs restrict specific books to make it easier on themselves, but it's no fun unless you have access to everything in the game in order to make the best of your character! (RP-wise, not munchkin-wise)

So it seems he also uses my tact--- he, too, must min-max his monsters/NPCs. So an 8th-level Druid? There're plenty of ways to go about it, but you'd have to look up some feats and such.

Make sure you get every Druid spell from the books on your list so as to not forget them. The Druid magic will come in handy. An item creation feat would be good, brew potion or craft wand. Definitely take Augment Summoning and, if you have Lost Empires of Faerun, take Greenbound Summoning feat. Combined together, you can summon the nastiest creatures of nature ever to hit your father-in-law's gaming table :D

Your animal companion should be the toughest you can acquire. Make sure to get Companion Spellbond from Player's Handbook 2.

If I think of anything else I'll let ya know.
 


Check out the Dire Eagle in Races of Stone for your animal companion. For one thing it flies and is strong enough to carry you, for two it's absolutely amazing! Grab Natural Bond to make it even amazinger.
-blarg
 

An interesting setup I was tinkering with

Feats: 2 at first level for being a human
1. Sacred Vow (taken at 1st)
2. Vow of Poverty (taken at 1st)
Then one at 3rd and one at 6th for being lvl 8 druid
1. Spell Focus (Conjuration) (taken at 3rd)
2. Augment Summoning (taken at 6th)
Then bonus feats from vow of poverty
1 at first level and 1 at 2nd level and every 2 levels after (4,6,8)
1. Nymph's Kiss (taken at 1st)
2. Exhalted Companion (taken at 2nd)
3. Exhalted Wild Shape (taken at 4th)
4. Servant of the Heavens (taken at 6th)
5. Vow of Purity(taken at 8th)
Equipment
27,000 GP for being level 8, however it would have been donated over time to people who needed it more leaving nothing left
Quarterstaff: 1d6 (20 x2) Bludgeoning
Simple White Robes
Simple Leather Shoes

Spells per day:
0(6) 1st(4+1) 2nd(3+1) 3rd(3+1) 4th(2+1)

Skill Points: (84 total at lvl 8)
1st Level Druid: (4+2) x 4 = 24
Each Level: (4+2) +1 for being human = 7 per level = 49 total
1st Level Human: 4 skill pts
Nymph's Kiss Taken at 1st level giving +7 skill pts
Heal 10 Ranks
Listen 10 Ranks
Ride 11 Ranks
Spot 11 Ranks
Survival 11 Ranks
Concentration 11 Ranks
Handle Animal 11 Ranks
Knowledge Nature 9 Ranks

Ability Scores Breakdown (32 point buy system) ... pts from levels added already
(+1)STR 12 (+1) at 4th level (+1) at 8th level
(+1)DEX 12
(+2)CON 14 (+2) at 7th level from Vow of Poverty
(+2)INT 14
(+4)WIS 18
(-1)CHA 8
 

I've played a VoP druid (my cat lady), it's ok. With Magic Item Compendium in play, it may be a bad idea, though. Especially if you think the DM will give out lots of treasure. One correction: Exalted Wildshape requires level 8. It IS awesome though, just for blink dog.
EDIT: Another downside to VoP for a druid is that a normal druid can drape the companion in magic items, but unless your DM is cool and lets the companion also take VoP, you end up with a weaker ally. In my case, I took Exalted Companion, which made my Tiger have int 3, NG alignment, and become a magical beast (celestial template), and he STILL wouldn't let me. He didn't really have a good argument for why not to allow it rules-wise, he just didn't want me to be any more powerful. (Which brings up another good druid tip: if you're trying to sweet talk the DM into allowing something, may want to hold back on displays of power :))

If ALL books are open, do be sure to pick up flaws from UA for an extra two feats. I'd recommend the ones for -2 ranged attacks and -3 will saves. The former is because druids don't get many ranged attack roll spells, and when they do, the -2 combined with medium BAB makes them just as good at it as a wizard. Which, for touch spells, is good enough. The -3 will is not too painful since you'll have high base will and high wisdom. Also, just as smart enemies don't bother tossing lightning bolts at rogues, I doubt most casters will bother trying a druid's will save.

Another interesting option (one my cat lady used with Tiger Totem) is Totem Druid, from dragon mag #335 (or here: http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Classes-Base.pdf page 35). You lose a LOT of versatility in wildshape, which may make it not worth it to most, but the benefits can really help out. It also gives you free natural spell and eventually the ability to talk in your totem shape (which counts as wildshape as normal -- if it didn't, you couldn't use Natural Spell), two very helpful boons for the druid that likes to stay in animal form. If you take this option, it definitely helps to pick up Exalted Wildshape at 8+ and Dragon Wildshape at level 12+ as feats, to expand your options. The latter feat is in dragon mag, as well as crystalkeep's feat index. Lets you turn into medium or smaller dragons of HD <= yours. Not as powerful as it sounds, trust me. Great for versatility, though!

Far as optimizing goes, I still would like a more specific idea what you want to do. But it's hard to NOT be overpowered, even just going straight druid. Really, imagine it's high school and all you have to do to get your diploma is say "I pick up Natural Spell."

The only other feat that comes close in power to you will be a reserve feat from C.Mage, Minor Shapechange. This requires a level 4-5 (I forget) polymorph spell (ie, can pick it up at level 9+) and allows several options as swift actions, which last for as many rounds as the level of the spell in reserve or until you pick a new option or refresh the one you had. The only one to care about is Vigor. It gives you temp hp equal to your HD. In other words, it's the Improved Toughness feat. Except...every time it gets depleted, you can spend a swift action to get it back!

I can recommend some amazing Druid spells if you like. They're all basically out of Spell Compendium and PHB, though.
 
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He mentioned taking Obtain Familiar feat, which will give you back the familiar you lost when taking the variant class feature.

Yeah, it's a feat, I think it's in Complete Arcane. So if you got Rapid Summoning and Obtain Familiar, you'd keep the familiar and for the cost of a feat, get to drop summon monster spells as a standard action, a VERY rare ability. Summoning usually takes 1 round, which means a concentration check to avoid losing the spell if you get struck between the first round and when it appears.
 

Damn party

Hahaha... so the party kinda screwed up that whole setup I was tinkering with >.< What I ended up with before is below, after taking the flaws recommended (very nice btw, thank you :D) The kink now is that the party wants to be evil... and the DM is definately leaning towards that. That's a problem since this whole setup with sacred vow, VoPov, VoPur, and the exhalted stuff... is geared more towards a good character. The DM recommended I take a look into the Book of Vile Evil, anyone know much of this book? Or, can anyone think of a way to gear this current setup towards an evil character?

Flaws: Poor Reflexes: -3 to REF saves
Weak Will: -3 on Will saves

Feats: 2 at first level for being a human
1. Sacred Vow (taken at 1st)
2. Vow of Poverty (taken at 1st)
2 bonus feats for 2 flaws selected
1. Spell Focus (Conjuration) (taken at 1st)
2. Augment Summoning (taken at 1st)
Then one at 3rd and one at 6th for being lvl 8 druid
1. Natural Spell (taken at 3rd)
2. Blindsight (taken at 6th)
Then bonus feats from vow of poverty
1 at first level and 1 at 2nd level and every 2 levels after (4,6,8)
1. Nymph's Kiss (taken at 1st)
2. Exhalted Companion (taken at 2nd)
3. Vow of Purity (taken at 4th)
4. Servant of the Heavens (taken at 6th)
5. Exhalted Wild Shape (taken at 8th)
 

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