A bit tired of people knocking videogames...

[billd91]

Honestly, going wayyyy back to the OP, I love it when people trot out the "it's too videogamey" refrain. At least it's honest. Sure, there might be that small number out there who is using it as a descriptor, but, IME, the vast majority are simply doing it to push buttons and score Internet points without actually having to make any sort of thought.

Makes filling out Ignore lists SOOO much easier.

You're free to have whatever prejudices you want, but the rules of this board suggest that you should not ascribe motives to people's posts as part of your own posting behavior. I would suggest smearing the vast majority of people who say that 4e is too videogamey as trolls isn't a board-friendly use of your post.

 

[billd91]

Now, imagine that this same conversation has been happening virtually every single time you cook for the past decade. Every time you make a particular dish, for the past ten years, someone chimes in that it's too Italian.

How much patience do you think you'd have for that?

I think the first thing I'd ask myself is "Why am I participating in this conversation?" On a message board, the only conversations I take part in are the ones I want to take part in. If the conversation is so repetitive and vexing, why participate at all?

 

[BryonD]

but, IME, the vast majority are simply doing it to push buttons and score Internet points without actually having to make any sort of thought.

You know, that point can easily be turned around.

There are a lot of points that can, and have been, explained to show why people find 4E to be "too videogamey". But it is a simple umbrella for a collection of points. That makes it easy for people who don't want to accept it to just automatically declare it meaningless and score Internet Points without actually having to make any sort of thought.

 

[Zhaleskra]

I'm not entirely sure why I'm replying to this again.

I like both book & dice RPGs and video games. The key here is that I like them separately. Do they inform each other? Certainly, but there's a point where the lines may cross too much, and there are people, like me, who do not like that.

Were I to say "it feels to video gamey" would mean it feels more like playing a video game than a book & dice RPG. To me that means it feels more like I should be using a controller and a console or computer, keyboard, and mouse than pencil & paper or computer data, dice, and my imagination.

The above is just an example. I do not recall ever saying anything was too "video gamey".

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

-the criticism of the dish actually has very little to do with Italian cuisine but rather with how someone perceives Italian cuisine that they rarely eat.

<snip>
How much patience do you think you'd have for that?

I can answer with 100% confidence: nigh infinite. You've just described one of my relatives who is an extremely picky eater.

So I know that when she complains about food- but for a couple key exceptions- she's utterly clueless. As a result, when I hear her critique a meal most of the time, I go "Uh huh." and don't engage her.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I like both book & dice RPGs and video games. The key here is that I like them separately. Do they inform each other? Certainly, but there's a point where the lines may cross too much, and there are people, like me, who do not like that.

Your post made me think: what if all of this were turned around?

What if in a new CRPG game, instead of having all those fluid combats, you had to press a button, which then rolled an electronic die in a window (bounce, bounce, bounce), then your PC did the action? And everything acted and moved only on its turn in the initiative? And if you tried an unusual maneuver, you had to call customer support to have an operator see what the exact effects were for your situation?

Could you call that CRPG "too tabletoppy?" Even though some of those elements are not unique to TTRPGs?

(I'd say yes.)

 

[Zhaleskra]

What if in a new CRPG game, instead of having all those fluid combats, you had to press a button, which then rolled an electronic die in a window (bounce, bounce, bounce), then your PC did the action? And everything acted and moved only on its turn in the initiative? And if you tried an unusual maneuver, you had to call customer support to have an operator see what the exact effects were for your situation?

Except for the customer support line, that actually happened in older CRPGs. Before Might & Magic VI, you even had to roll your characters, and it did show the 3d6 bouncing in a window. 6 still referenced dice (on weapons), though all you saw was the result. It also introduced the ability to switch between real time and turn based. Going even further back are the SSI D&D based computer games.

 

[Mark CMG]

I wonder if a player can barrage the video game Customer Support address with endless emails between game sessions about why the video game was wrong to do what it did because the character's background, as written by the player, clearly showed his entire family was dead, so the kidnapping couldn't have happened, and anyway the tattoo on his right side (page four of section one of the background) is suppose to glow whenever danger is happening to anyone he knows, plus even though in-game it is only a sword of wounding, the player emphatically stated he wouldn't use it unless it could also be tied to his lineage and to eat the souls of the slain so the character (named Zacharia, though it was misspelt during character creation and the stupid game won't allow changes) can have an endless lifepool. Cause I used to have a tabletop player I can send their way.

 

[Glade Riven]

I'm sure it happens. I've worked tech support, and people call in for the strangest things.

 

[Diamond Cross]

Your post made me think: what if all of this were turned around?

Actually I wish there were CRPGS that were like this. I much prefer CRPGS to do something like this because I have a hard time with real time strategy stuff.

I'd love to have my own company which made these kinds of games.