A charge and tumble question

[Branok]

At the risk of sounding foolish , the question is the following:

When a character is charging, can he tumble to avoid attacks of opportunity?
i ask this because I know that you can't charge through difficult terrain or obstacles, unless you have the acrobatic charge special class ability (Swashbuckler in the CW), but I haven't found anything mentioning attacks of opportunity.

I'd really appreciate if you could answer this question. Thanks.

 

[Pielorinho]

I could be wrong, but I don't see anything in the rules to forbid it. Lemme look again at Tumble rules and Charge rules....

Daniel

 

[Pielorinho]

Okay, here's the relevant SRD sections:

CHARGING
Charging is a special full-round action that allows you to move up to twice your speed and attack during the action. However, it carries tight restrictions on how you can move.
Movement During a Charge: You must move before your attack, not after. You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent.
You must have a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement (such as difficult terrain or obstacles). Here’s what it means to have a clear path. First, you must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent. (If this space is occupied or otherwise blocked, you can’t charge.) Second, if any line from your starting space to the ending space passes through a square that blocks movement, slows movement, or contains a creature (even an ally), you can’t charge. (Helpless creatures don’t stop a charge.)
If you don’t have line of sight to the opponent at the start of your turn, you can’t charge that opponent.
You can’t take a 5-foot step in the same round as a charge.
If you are able to take only a standard action or a move action on your turn, you can still charge, but you are only allowed to move up to your speed (instead of up to double your speed). You can’t use this option unless you are restricted to taking only a standard action or move action on your turn.

TUMBLING
Tumble at one-half speed as part of normal movement, provoking no attacks of opportunity while doing so. Failure means you provoke attacks of opportunity normally. Check separately for each opponent you move past, in the order in which you pass them (player’s choice of order in case of a tie).
Each additional enemy after the first adds +2 to the Tumble DC.

Neither of these seems to preclude the other. The only thing that comes close is the bolded text: you can't tumble through a square that slows movement, and tumbling out of a threatened square slows your movement to 1/2. However, I'd say it's the tumbling action, not the square itself, that slows your movement, and that it therefore isn't verboten.

If your DM objects, have him watch Bladerunner again, paying even more attention to Darryl Hannah than he otherwise would .
Daniel

 

[Methos of Aundair]

Quoted from the SRD under Charge

1. You must have a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement (such as difficult terrain or obstacles).
2. Second, if any line from your starting space to the ending space passes through a square that blocks movement, slows movement, or contains a creature (even an ally), you can’t charge. (Helpless creatures don’t stop a charge.)

Quoted from the SRD under Tumble

Tumble at one-half speed as part of normal movement, provoking no attacks of opportunity while doing so.
Tumble at one-half speed through an area occupied by an enemy (over, under, or around the opponent) as part of normal movement
Accelerated Tumbling: You try to tumble past or through enemies more quickly than normal. By accepting a –10 penalty on your Tumble checks, you can move at your full speed instead of one-half your speed.

1. Notice under charge it states “nothing can hinder your movement”. In my opinion if you need to tumble than something must be hindering your movement.

2. Under charge it states “that blocks movement, slows movement”; the tumble skill does state you move at one-half speed. So again, I feel you cannot tumble during a charge.

 

[Hypersmurf]

When a character is charging, can he tumble to avoid attacks of opportunity?

If you're talking DC 15 (Tumble at half speed), definitely not. A character may not Charge when he is restricted to half speed. (See the definition of half speed ni the PHB Glossary.)

If you're talking DC 25 (Tumble at full speed), it's dependent on your definition of 'normal movement'.

The Sage defines 'normal movement' in the Rules of the Game article on Movement as 'using a Move action to travel up to your speed'.

Since Charge is not a Move action, it's not normal movement, and thus you can't 'Tumble at full speed as part of normal movement' while Charging.

-Hyp.

 

[dcollins]

Tumble at one-half speed as part of normal movement...

I have always read that "normal movement" to mean "a plain old regular move action and nothing else", i.e., no running or charging or anything more exotic. If you expand that you need to decide exactly what counts as "normal movement".

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I'd rule against it, but not for the reasons above - in all cases, it's not the square itself which is causing the slowdown, it's the tumbling.

In other words, you can't charge through heavy overgrowth or through an entanglement spell or through waist-deep water.

Therefore, there's no problem with charging past a bad guy, unless he's on difficult terrain.

The problem comes when you want to charge past a badguy and avoid his AoO.

In that case, I'd disallow Tumbling while charging based on the text of Tumble: "as part of normal movement."

Normal movement is taking a move action or two.

Charging is not normal movement; it is a specific action unto itself.

However, I could certainly see a DM going the other way on this - if for no other reason than that the text is not 100% clear, and it might look cinematically awesome.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If your DM objects, have him watch Bladerunner again, paying even more attention to Darryl Hannah than he otherwise would .

PrC ability, obviously.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I have always read that "normal movement" to mean "a plain old regular move action and nothing else".

Right. That agrees with the Sage's definition.

Normal movement is taking a move action or two.

Charging is not normal movement; it is a specific action unto itself.

So does that.

-Hyp.

 

[Darklone]

Wasn't there a PrClass ability in CW that allowed to tumble during a charge?