D&D 4E A couple of things that suck about the 4e SRD/OGL

[Oldtimer]

Uh-huh. As opposed to all those years where we had no legal access to create supplements which claimed compatibility with D&D at all?

That was the Stone Age.

(Though I remember Mayfair Games selling such supplements)

 

[Incenjucar]

On the plus side, this could actually lead to people attempting to design new rules systems. With the 3E SRD, you had much less motivation for innovation, but now there's more reason for the next White Wolf to emerge... or Guardians of Order... It'll be a VERY interesting year, I think, all around, and while I sympethize with those who put (way too much) faith in equal access for all time, I'm all for the occassional shake up in the gaming world to keep things fresh.

 

[Ranger REG]

liked most of the announcement about the SRD/OGL, there were some things that were understandable, like the early access fee and phased release schedule, but there were others I really don't like.

1) All OGL products will require the PHB.

Meh. I'll wait until the new OGL will require d20 Modern.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Don't think it means no variant rules, but for sure it means no "4e updates" for M&M, Spycraft, Arcana Evolved, or anything else of the same vein.

Doubt that.

AE didn't need the OGL. Spycraft and M&M didn't need the D&D rules.

Because mechanics are not really protectable, any company can make any rules that are compatible with D&D. They can use all of 4e's core rules (d20 resolution, levels, tiers, hit points, etc.) without paying WotC a dime.

They just can't really SAY that in the product, because D&D itself is a trademark, and is protected.

What they can do is use language that dodges the trademarks and copyrights and still implies compatability (a la "Compatible with the 4th Edition!"), which can get a little muddy, but means that they're probably legally safe.

If you're going to heavily alter the system like that anyway, you're on safe ground. No one is going to suspect Spycraft of being D&D, despite the similar mechanics. And even the mechanics have enough difference that it's clearly NOT the same game, even though they might be compatible.

All this will do is re-inforce 3e's idea that you can't duplicate the XP table or give rules for character advancement, a little more strongly. I think that selling the books using 3rd parties is something they really want to do, and it's how this new OGL/SRD pair is focused, but they really can't stop people from making compatible products and even marketing them as compatible products. This just creates an odd little void in the advertising language where "D&D4e" would normally go. Which is probably okay, because if the prospective customers don't know what "the 4th Edition of the world's most popular role playing game" is, then the compatibility issue doesn't matter for them at all anyway.

I'm mostly just a little bummed that I can't just save $100 and game from the SRD.

 

[Ranger REG]

On the plus side, this could actually lead to people attempting to design new rules systems. With the 3E SRD, you had much less motivation for innovation,

Less motivation? With the strict parameter of 4e OGL and SRD, you would have more motivation to take 3e SRD and evolve it independently of WotC. Even create a whole new ruleset, a la True20.

 

[Ranger REG]

Because mechanics are not really protectable, any company can make any rules that are compatible with D&D. They can use all of 4e's core rules (d20 resolution, levels, tiers, hit points, etc.) without paying WotC a dime.

You can take the concept. You just cannot take the text. Use your own words.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Piratecat
The new version of the OGL isn’t as open-ended as the current version. Any 4e OGL product must use the 4e PHB as the basis of their game. If they can’t use the core rule books, it won’t be possible to create the game under this particular version of the OGL.


This bit seems strange to me, because it sounds as if - effectively - the d20 license has been renamed to the OGL license, and the old-style OGL license has disappeared.

Speculation: With 3e it was anticipated that the majority of companies would go for d20 licensed products, and it was a bit of a surprise that Mongoose, Green Ronin (and others?) have been able to take the OGL side and run with it to bring out whole new, successful product lines; I've got no idea about the actual facts and figures but when I visit my FLGS it seems that there are a lot more OGL than third party d20 products out there.

Further Speculation: Direct competitors rather than participators in an add-on market isn't what they want, so in practice WotC want to kill the OGL license and leave only the d20 license there (the one which predicates the use of the PHB alongside the product). For some reason (maybe the OGL name has more traction now?) they want the license to be headlined as 'OGL' even though the new license seems soundly based on the older, more restrictive d20 license.

Of course, this breeds the possibility of confusion, because when someone says 'OGL' they won't necessarily know whether it is 'old, unrestricted 3e OGL' or 'new, restricted 4e OGL'.

So it seems like a bit of a mess regarding naming standards to me, but it will be interesting to see how things pan out.

Cheers

 

[Raven Crowking]

This bit seems strange to me, because it sounds as if - effectively - the d20 license has been renamed to the OGL license, and the old-style OGL license has disappeared.

Which would make 4e, in all reality, not an OGL game.

I wonder how this is going to affect EN World, which is surely Gleemax's biggest competitor? Will a 4e House Rules forum or Creature Catalog be viable under the 4e "OGL"?

RC

 

[I'm A Banana]

You can take the concept. You just cannot take the text. Use your own words.

Badabingbangboom.

I mean, sure, those products have a little bit of the 'generic' twinge to them, like those Malt-O-Meal cereals, and it'll be a bit of a 'worst kept secret' kind of scenario, but if WotC wants to restrict it....well, like Jurassic Park teaches us, life will find a way. It might not be elegant, it might not be ideal, but it should do you quite nicely

 

[Ranger REG]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Piratecat
The new version of the OGL isn’t as open-ended as the current version. Any 4e OGL product must use the 4e PHB as the basis of their game. If they can’t use the core rule books, it won’t be possible to create the game under this particular version of the OGL.


This bit seems strange to me, because it sounds as if - effectively - the d20 license has been renamed to the OGL license, and the old-style OGL license has disappeared.

I may be required to use hearing aids, but that sounds like it to me, too.

Sighs.