A Fluffy and Crunchy Concept (share yours!)

[Noicus]

So I was looking at the Ranger's released Paragon path, and it just screamed Eladrin to me, and I got to thinking. If the class training feats let you get 2 class features from another class (which will probably take 2 feats, hope you get some at wills as encounters or some other such) you could make a really fun to play, and hell even "controllerish" ranger.

Use class training feats to get warlocks curse and feystep and then you could be bliping around smelling of elderberries all day. Now this is full of conjecture, but this is what I envision being able to do as an Alpha Strike against bunched foes.. Encounter starts with some bunched up bad guys. Use Feystep(Racial power) to blip behind their line. Your minor action is used to Curse one guy then hit them with your standard action, Clearing the Ground Push them around to form an L and burn an action point to get another standard action use Cold Steel Hurricane shift into the crook of the L and hit them all again. You can then use Stormstep Action to move where you would like, and possibly Feystep (warlock class ability) right after that. Leaving you in a safe spot and leaving them all bunched up for the Wizard, or other AOE capable class.

I think I might even Drizzt it up and use Scimitars so I can take Scimitar Dance.

Using the Point Buy System discribed in the PrRC he would have these stats:
Str 16/Dex 18/Con 12/Int 10/Wis 10/Cha 14
(The high Cha over Wis is because I envision using any warlock abilities I get access to over using the bow)

As I read more Hunter's Quarry plus Warlock's Curse has alot of nice Synergy

Does anyone else have any critiques on this idea, or any cool ideas for a character using what info we have avalible to us now?

 

[1of3]

I have a fealing that class training gets you Powers from another class but not Class Features. Especially not marking or striker damage abilities.

If I could class features with a single feat, why bother with becoming a Warpriest, if I could get the Paladin's superior marking with a feat?

 

[Noicus]

I have a fealing that class training gets you Powers from another class but not Class Features. Especially not marking or striker damage abilities.

If I could class features with a single feat, why bother with becoming a Warpriest, if I could get the Paladin's superior marking with a feat?

It seems to me that the class features are the defining aspects of the class, limiting your access to them would make you not much like them. also we have seen a lot of powers which are effected by class features. If you can't have access to them it really neuters the whole concept of mutliclassing.

If it is like that, I can see people only taking class training feats to open up paragon paths and epic destinies, and WOTC has said they are trying to get rid of sub-optimal choices.

Now a 1st level ranger might be overpowered with both Warlock's Curse and Hunter's Quarry, but it still takes 2 minor actions, which either takes 2 turns to do, or eats your move action. , and seeing how mobility is so important in this edition, that would be a decision you would have to make turn by turn. It also wouldn't be that OP once you had some levels under your belt. Also another thing to think about is while a 1st level ranger in 3E doing 3d6 damage might one shot a bad guy (11.5 damage on average) in 4E it wouldn't even drop something to bloodied

and to answer your direct question if you are burning a feat to get the marking you aren't using that feat to up your survivability, it is probably a poor choice to draw aggro like that if you are still squishy. and another answer to your question from somthing i read in the thread on the Paragon classes:

Paragon Paths look pretty nice all in all, but one thing has me worried.

Some of these things look sort of multi-classy, like the warpriest that clearly makes a cleric more defender-ish, or that rumoured PP that lets a wizard use a sword as a wand.

You shouldn't have to wait until level 11 to play the character you want. If you were going for a warpriest, what are the odds that you didn't go for some of that stuff much earlier?

 

[Crosswind]

I'll bet a lot that you don't get other class' features. Only powers. Here's the short answer of why:

4.0 has wisely decided to limit the number of abilities that you can bring to the table in a single round. A Standard, a move, and a minor. Allowing you to spend a feat to pick up a different variety of maneuvers that are used in addition to yours? Probably ok.

Allowing you to spend a feat to add passive abilities which can be used all the time (Sneak attack, for instance)? Hugely overpowering. Who in their right mind wouldn't multiclass to rogue if you could pick up sneak attack with a 1-level dip?

Limiting sub-optimal choices isn't the same as eliminating them - sub-optimal choices will always exist, particularly if you choose an ability and then don't utilize it. People who are multiclassing should look to pick up abilities that have good synergy with their primary class.

-Cross

 

[arscott]

I won't be a 1-level dip--It will be a feat.

But I expect that feat to give you a taste of another class's powers (if not the real thing). 1d6 sneak attack with rogue training 1, for example.

 

[ShockMeSane]

I won't be a 1-level dip--It will be a feat.

But I expect that feat to give you a taste of another class's powers (if not the real thing). 1d6 sneak attack with rogue training 1, for example.

Considering you get a feat every other level, and some of the paragon level feats we have seen are things like "Your cold attacks give your target cold vulnerability 5", it it seems pretty unlikely to me that at level 1 you will be able to spend your feat to pick up Sneak Attack as a Warlock or Ranger. I have a feeling that if you want access to class features, you will be able to get them at level 11, Multiclassing instead of taking a Paragon Path has been mentioned, and I think this is what the benefit will be, just like taking Wizard Multi-class at 11 will grant you the ability to cast Rituals, etc.

Of course this is all complete conjecture. But I suppose thats what message boards are for.

 

[arscott]

I think you're overestimating the power of 1d6 sneak attack damage. (Note: a 1st-level rogue gets 2d6--I'm conjecturing that the feats give you nerfed versions of class abilities to start with).

It's an average of 3.5 extra damage that applies only when:
You've got combat advantage
and
You're wielding certain weapons.

But rogue abilities are in part built around gaining combat advantage, and fighting with rogue weapons. A multi-classer's primary class won't have those advantages. So the multi-classed character will have to sacrifice a decent amount of primary-class capability in order to be particularly effective with sneak attack. So 1d6 is hardly broken.