A Quote from Robin Laws

[rounser]

the d20 license is perceived now as an albatross.

Rime of the Ancient Mariner d20, anyone?

The many men so beautiful
And they all dead did lie!
And a million million slimy things
Liv'd on--and so did I.

Given that it can't be revoked, in a way it does "live on" in undeath.

 

[Glyfair]

Given that it can't be revoked, in a way it does "live on" in undeath.

Sorry to quibble, but it can. It's the OGL that can't be revoked. The d20 license can be revoked.

 

[rounser]

Sorry to quibble, but it can. It's the OGL that can't be revoked. The d20 license can be revoked.

Okay, okay....then maybe, d20's the albatross, the crew is the third party publishing industry, the mariner's WOTC (shooting the albatross with 3.5 and 4E), and the OGL is the "night-mare life-in-death was she who thicks men's hearts with cold."

Or something.

 

[Pale]

There's a stigma to having "d20" on your books because of all the crap product that was churned out in the beggining? All I've ever heard is from some die-hards who won't accept anything that isn't WotC as "official" D&D. Changing a label won't change closed minds.

Seems to me that the good companies succeeded because they have the talent. Everyone who has been playing the last five years or so knows which third-party companies are good for them (for me it's S&SS, Necromancer, Monte's company, Privateer and Green Ronin) and which aren't.

4E OGL isn't going to breathe life into companies that turn out bad product. "Turd 4E OGL" is going to be as just as bad as "Turd d20".

 

[DaveMage]

I wonder what the d20 landscape would be like if Fast Forward hadn't existed....

 

[Glyfair]

There's a stigma to having "d20" on your books because of all the crap product that was churned out in the beggining?

Yes.

All I've ever heard is from some die-hards who won't accept anything that isn't WotC as "official" D&D. Changing a label won't change closed minds.

Exactly. This isn't what they are talking about, though. Those players are mostly unreachable.

4E OGL isn't going to breathe life into companies that turn out bad product. "Turd 4E OGL" is going to be as just as bad as "Turd d20".

Part of his points seems to be that those companies are pretty much gone, so they would be cluttering up the d20 market. At least it's true in print.

 

[Scribble]

Part of his points seems to be that those companies are pretty much gone, so they would be cluttering up the d20 market. At least it's true in print.

Shrug... Until a new crop of publishers decide to jump in on the chance they missed last time...

 

[SiderisAnon]

Shrug... Until a new crop of publishers decide to jump in on the chance they missed last time...

That may be a little harder than last time. It seems like in at least the PDF market, the consumer is a little more savvy. People pay attention to reviews, sites talk about the products, and the names of really bad products seem to get around. (At least in my experience.)

Based partially on my own experience, it seems like people picked up the shiny new products because they were there, but then as the market glutted had to start being very choosy in what they were going to spend their money on. Now I won't deny that some of the garbage products I've purchased in the past haven't made me leery of new products, but I believe that they've make me more picky rather than made me unwilling to buy at all.

I am hoping that with the new 3rd party products that are bound to come out with 4th Edition, the garbage will quickly be recognized and the good stuff will be noted, so that we can quickly send the message to these companies through our spending habits.

Then again, I may be proven completely and totally wrong. After all, I know of at least one print company that has been putting out absolute rubbish as far as quality since the late 80's at least, and they still keep selling their books.