A real fighting bard.

[HighlandsBear]

Activating bardic music is a standard action but there's no duration while you are just fighting and moving, right? Once you stop its 5 rounds of effect duration. (Wasn't clear in my old PHB but was told otherwise and its now clearly that way in the new SRD.) A cleric or wizard could, in that same standard action, cast a much better buff such as holy aura or summon a monster or better yet just kill the monster outright. In fact a fighter may do more damage in that activation round than the bards buff song will through a 5-7 round fight (depends on how many meleers you have?) Seems to me the bard's music abilities just load him up with the same type of lower level spells he already has!

I dont like the fighter BAB idea cause it just makes them better archers than they already are. Give them d8 hit dice instead and maybe they could enter the melee. I definitely don't think this is unbalancing.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I dont like the fighter BAB idea cause it just makes them better archers than they already are. Give them d8 hit dice instead and maybe they could enter the melee. I definitely don't think this is unbalancing.

This is a good point. By maintaining the low hit die with a high BAB, bards become even more geared toward archery. By upping their hit die, that puts them more in line with a druid, who'd have the same BAB and hit die, and caster level, though different special abilities. The druid would still have the spellcasting edge, with 3 more levels of spells, though that may be preferable, flavor-wise...

 

[JiffyPopTart]

One aspect of the bard that you are forgetting is his Class Skills list.

The bard is the "jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none" and as such can fill the role of a fighter/wizard/and rogue all at the same time. With this flexibility, the trade off is that he does none of them particularly well.


DS

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

One aspect of the bard that you are forgetting is his Class Skills list.

The bard is the "jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none" and as such can fill the role of a fighter/wizard/and rogue all at the same time. With this flexibility, the trade off is that he does none of them particularly well.

Which, like the "humans can do anything, but can't do anything as good as the race designed for it" makes it a great deal less powerful than dedicated classes. Third Edition and Revised did well to give the Bard his own niche, as well as his generalist role,
and I think that people are really overlooking it.

When dealing with any kind of intelligent humanoid, the Bard is incredibly powerful. They can inspire their allies, terrify their enemies, and use more subtle skills to get their way in several different ways. In the city, the Bard is easily your most powerful character.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

When dealing with any kind of intelligent humanoid, the Bard is incredibly powerful. They can inspire their allies, terrify their enemies, and use more subtle skills to get their way in several different ways. In the city, the Bard is easily your most powerful character.

I disagree. In the city, a bard is competent. But the rogue is easily your most powerful character.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

I think you underestimate things like Bardic Knowledge and the various Bardic Song abilities, as well as the Bard's spells.

The Rogue is the weenar and champeen of urban combat, but the Bard is the master of never seeing combat he doesn't need to.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

I think, ultimately, a Bard has screwed up his job if he actually ends up in combat with anything that has an intelligence.

DS