A Technical Look at D&D Insider Applications

[Hussar]

Look - paying a nominal fee for the pdf after you've bought the hardcover is what the issue is that is being discussed - but why is it an issue at all? Because they aren't offering the ability to buy the pdf by itself and they are making it onerous to buy the pdf after you've bought the book. They need to take a hint from all of the 3rd party publishers who offer their customers the option of buying a paper product, or a pdf, or both, without buying one being a prerequisite to buying the other. And it won't matter anyway, because as soon as the first person with too much time on their hands OCRs a hardcover and posts it on a p2p site, game over; WotC's paranoid special codes and secret handshakes to buy a pdf will be circumvented. Better to treat your customers as customers instead of potential thieves.

How exactly is it onerous?

Go to site. Punch in code. Download pdf.

 

[Scribble]

Hmm - I guess that WotC feels that the amount of 3.5 pdf product they sold at full (or close to full) hardcover price somehow means that people want to pay those prices twice for the same product just because it is in a different format? I know plenty of people who want only the hardcover or only the pdf. If WotC isn't offering them options, they'll go elsewhere.

Just take a look on ENWorld's front page - War of the Burning Sky: $6.99 for a pdf, $13.99 for a softcover, or $49.99 for a subscription to all 12 pdfs (which is roughly $4 each).

If a small press outfit offers the ability to buy just a pdf, or just a paper book, then the desire for those options exists - the market share of those who will buy from WotC is much larger, which means that the ratio of people who want only a pdf or only a paper book is much larger...

Bottom line - regardless of the existence of the DDI, if WotC doesn't offer the option to only buy a pdf or only buy a paper book, at appropriate price points, then they deserve to go the way of the buggy whip makers and record labels...

I think part of the issue is that WOTC has always been about supporting the Local Game store. I think this tactic is just another method of doing so. People want online resources, WOTC wants to offer them. WOTC also wants to sell hard covers because the hard covers support the game stores which in turn support them. Offering the PDF with the hardcover increases the desire to purchase the hardcover.

 

[Scott_Rouse]

Ok - so if just a pdf costs $2, then any additional cost beyond that and the basic price of the book for what would be the "deluxe edition" of the book would have to include the costs of pressing the CD (pennies), and the costs of glueing a CD pouch into the back cover.




And how many people really care about that? I'd wager that the majority of the people who want pdfs want them so they don't have to lug a ton of books to their game, not to play over the internet.

FYI putting CDs in books does not cost pennies. The cost of doing this is dollars.

 

[Scott_Rouse]

The problem *isn't* that people are looking for something to bitch about. The problem is the well-established Hasbro corporate attitude that may end up having corporate guys require WotC low-level employees to lie to our faces about what they are going to do...

I much prefer being told the truth rather than being strung along. Unfortunately - I don't see that happening from Hasbro and WotC.

I get the sense you are going to believe what you want but let me point out a few things.

A) I am not lying. I have truthfully told you what I know and can tell you at this time.

B) Hasbro owns us but this is not some top down policy coming from Rhode Island.

C) Wotc has made this plan. Myself and a team of others are the ones driving this.

D) If people continue to direct this insulting "they are lying to us" garbage at people like me I for one will stop posting.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I get the sense you are going to believe what you want but let me point out a few things.
<snip>
D) If people continue to direct this insulting "they are lying to us" garbage at people like me I for one will stop posting.

Sometimes, being a designer for a product with a big and vocal fan-base can be hard. Very Hard
But the first thing you said is why I you think you shouldn't put D) in effect.

Never ever give in to those that post with bile and hate. Put them on your mental or software-managed Ignore List. It is hard to believe if you see negative posts, but any WotC guy posting on these or other boards is seen as usually seen more as a gift as anything else.

For fans, it will feel like punishment (even if you're actually only protecting your mental health ), and some heaters might feel like they have "won" something.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

Sometimes, being a designer for a product with a big and vocal fan-base can be hard. Very Hard
But the first thing you said is why I you think you shouldn't put D) in effect.

Never ever give in to those that post with bile and hate. Put them on your mental or software-managed Ignore List.

Seriously. Ignore function is there for a reason. If they're going to insult you, they lose the right to be heard.

For fans, it will feel like punishment (even if you're actually only protecting your mental health ), and some heaters might feel like they have "won" something.

"See? I told you. That Rouse guy stopped talking to us. I must have uncovered his dastardly plot to feed us lies and misinformation. Good riddance!"

Ah, the logic of intarweb.

 

[Raven Crowking]

D) If people continue to direct this insulting "they are lying to us" garbage at people like me I for one will stop posting.

Speaking of which, kudos on the podcasts. I know that it might not be related, but there have been some recent bits & pieces coming from WotC that make me think that you are listening to what sort of questions/concerns are being raised here, and are starting to provide some answers.

Please keep it up!

As I said earlier, I doubt that, deep down, there is a gamer here who doesn't want every new product to be so worthwhile that they have to buy it. And, even if we aren't "wow"ed by one product, we always hope to be "wow"ed by the next.

RC

 

[3catcircus]

FYI putting CDs in books does not cost pennies. The cost of doing this is dollars.

I never said that putting CDs in books costs pennies. I said that pressing CDs costs pennies - approximately 45 cents each for 1,000 replications with 4 color silk screen print on disc, glass master, and all film (http://cheapcdduplications.com/google_htmls/cd_bulk.html)

 

[3catcircus]

I get the sense you are going to believe what you want but let me point out a few things.

A) I am not lying. I have truthfully told you what I know and can tell you at this time.

B) Hasbro owns us but this is not some top down policy coming from Rhode Island.

C) Wotc has made this plan. Myself and a team of others are the ones driving this.

D) If people continue to direct this insulting "they are lying to us" garbage at people like me I for one will stop posting.

You may think that it is garbage, but, unfortunately, perception is reality. The perception I have (and apparently, so do others) is that there is no good reason for requiring someone to buy a hardcover in order to be able to buy a pdf of the same information. It feels like gouging rather than a choice for consumers because of the requirement to buy a hardcover in order to enter a code to buy a pdf.

Is it really that important to require a book purchase prior to selling us a pdf that WotC is willing to lose sales to people who would never buy the book to begin with but would be willing to buy just a pdf?

I've bought about half of the current 3.x books. Of the books that I didn't buy, there may have been one or two gems of information that I was interested in but couldn't justify buying the entire book just to get one or two pages out of the entire book. Sell me a relatively cheap pdf and I'd buy every 3.x book as a pdf. Likewise, offer me the ability to buy just the pdf for 4th edition books and I'd buy every one of them.

 

[3catcircus]

How exactly is it onerous?

Go to site. Punch in code. Download pdf.

The fact that you have to punch in a code at all is onerous to me because it feels like you don't want to charge me once for the same information - you want to charge me twice. Even if it is only another $2, you are charging me *twice* for the same information.