A wee bit of PC design...

[Dannyalcatraz]

I'm considering retiring my original PC from a recently reactivated campaign in favor of something new.

The party was notoriously low on healing- no permanent party members with more than 2nd level divine spells- so much of the party gold was spent on potions, etc. I'm considering filling that gap.

But instead of a straight Clc or Drd, I want to do something a bit different.

I'm thinking: Clc of Obad-Hai/Specialist Wizard/Geomancer, mixing in elements of Merlin & Swamp Thing.

1) Geomancer gets me Drift (how cool is that?!) and spell versatility. The latter gets me limited armored spellcasting and the ability to freely mix & match my spellcasting. It also grants a bonus based on a chosen environment, but I don't see that being a crucial issue. Still, given the nature of this concept, I'd probably go "Forest."

As for Drift, I'd probably go either with emphasizing the "planty" changes, or finding a nifty mix of animal attributes.

2) Cleric gets me spontaneous healing- one of the main reasons I'm going this route. Coupled with Geomancer, I'll even be able to convert some arcane spells to heals. As for Domains, I'm thinking Animal & Plant, with an overall emphasis on making this PC a summoner of some kind.

3) SpecWiz gets me bonus feats and nearly as many spell slots as the Sorcerer, plus a faster progression. Still haven't figured out whether to go with Transmuter, Conjurer, Necromancer or Enchanter. If I go with a summoning build, I'll probably go with Conj. Enchanter is if I go more "Merlinesque." Necromancer is if I want to help embody death as a part of the circle of life. Transmuter is if I want to go with the adaptive quality of nature.

4) Sourcebooks available: 3Ed PHB, the softcover splatbooks, CompWar. Others possible upon request.

5) Races: PHB only

6) Level: 12 I'm leaning towards Clc3/Wiz3/Geo6. Since we have a single-classed mage, I'm leaning towards an unbalanced spellcasting progression from Geo- probably a Clc4/Wiz2 split. This would make the PC effectively a Divine caster 7/Arcane Caster5. All of the PC's arcane spells would be castable in armor.

Suggestions? Ideas? Equipment? Refinements? All of this is just my first impression of the character. I'm still open minded about where to go with it.

 

[Dross]

Either the Complete Divine of Arcane had a revised Geomancer. I haven't compared the two but you should if possible to check out if they added any extra drifts.

My 1st thoughts was that druid shapechange would have been a nice fit, but you would loose too much trying to make the shapechange viable.

Don't you need to be able to cast 2nd level spells, so a wiz3/Clr3 is the entry requirement?

I'd look at the wizard list and see what "big time contributions" you can make casting a wizard spell that the other caster can't. Then I'd up the divine' side casting abilities for the rest.

 

[Starbuck_II]

Either the Complete Divine of Arcane had a revised Geomancer. I haven't compared the two but you should if possible to check out if they added any extra drifts.

My 1st thoughts was that druid shapechange would have been a nice fit, but you would loose too much trying to make the shapechange viable.

Don't you need to be able to cast 2nd level spells, so a wiz3/Clr3 is the entry requirement?

I'd look at the wizard list and see what "big time contributions" you can make casting a wizard spell that the other caster can't. Then I'd up the divine' side casting abilities for the rest.

Well precocious Apprentice + Focused Specialist has multiple 2nd level spells at 1st (of his specialized school). But requires human to get 2 feats (without flaws).

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

More details and answers to your questions:

1) Yes, to qualify for Geomancer (either edition), my minimum base class requirements would be Clc3 or Drd3/Wiz3. And as you rightfully recognize, Geomancer would take away from the Shapechanging, especially in a 3Ed campaign where that power comes at 5th (as I recall).

I checked the Drifts, and found them to be essentially identical. Right now, I'm leaning for taking all the "planty" ones. As I recall, the odd thing about that is that there are 2 at Drift 1, 2 at Drift 2, and 1 at Drift 3...and that's it. The DM is a pretty good guy and may let me "reskin" some of the Drift options to reflect a further drift into the plant world.

2) In keeping with the planty trend, I was thinking that the Cleric of Obad-Hai would have Plant and Earth as his domains.

3) Wiz gives you more of the big name offensive spells, sometimes at lower levels than Clc (if both classes have them). At this point, I'm leaning towards Clc3/Wiz3/Geo6 (making the effective spellcaster levels of Clc7/Wis5), or Clc3/Wiz5/Geo4 with the same spellcaster levels. With either build, the PC will be able to cast his full arsenal of arcane spells in full armor, but in the latter, he'll get that bonus Metamagic or Item Creation feat.

The open question, of course, is which Metamagic or Item Creation feats, if any, make this PC click? Empower is a semi-obvious one, since I can use it to boost both offensive spells and whatever heals I toss. But are there any others? Extend? Reach? Energy Sub (in 3Ed, "sonic" is still available, but I'm not sure I can justify it for this PC)?

4) I'm really trending towards making this PC a Transmuter on the Wiz side, eschewing Conjuration spells. Unless I misunderstand the rules, he'd still be able to use clerical Conjuration spells, right?

5) As yet, I can't use anything like Precocious Apprentice or Focused Specialist- they're not in the allowed sourcebooks. Neither are flaws.

 

[Asha'man]

So you're playing an actual 3.0 campaign? That's a rare beast these days. Fun, though. Let's see what we can do.

First of all, I wouldn't ask the DM about flaws or Precocious Apprentice -they're kind of dubious. I would try to convince the DM to allow the Mystic Theurge PRC. Even though it's more powerful in 3.0 than it is in 3.5, because of the Haste nerf, a multiclassed caster honestly needs it to be viable. And you wouldn't take it all the way through anyway, because of your Geomancer focus.

If the DM doesn't allow Mystic Theurge, I'd almost advise you to try another build. (Verdant Lord?) but if you really want to play this, (and I can see why, it's a really cool idea) I'd go with the Clr 3/Wiz 5 version, for the extra feat. The problem with this is that at the end of Geomancer, at Clr 3/Wiz 5/Geo 10 (With, presumably, Clr 11/Wiz 7 casting), you will be casting Enervation while the other caster casts Energy Drain, Haste while he casts Time Stop, and Blade Barrier while he casts Prismatic Wall. Also, you will hardly ever penetrate the SR of anything close to your CR, even in forests. In other words, "big name offensive spells" are nothing but a trap.

It's not all awful, though, although you'll have to resign yourself to not actually being a caster, but rather a buffer and high-maintenance warrior-type. At level 12, between Haste, Shield and full plate armor, your AC should really be something, and with Divine Power, you can contribute on the front line. With spells like Resist Elements, Shield Other and Protection from Evil, you can make the party more durable. Take Craft Wand as your bonus wizard feat, without question. The more spell slots you have, the better. Use it to make wands of utility and buff spells, and use it whenever you have the opportunity. Don't forget to use your free Scribe Scroll, either. As a nice bonus, you'll get a tidy discount on Wands of Cure Light Wounds, the most cost-effective means of post-battle healing. Which reminds me. Don't heal in combat, because with your low healing abilities, it's only worthwhile if it directly saves someone's life. Over the course of a turn, enemies deal out more damage than you can heal, at least until you get high enough in level to cast the actual Heal spell.

Specialization is a good idea, either as a Transmuter or an Abjurer, but dropping Conjuration is not. Grease, Fog Cloud, Glitterdust, Web, and Sleet Storm are all useful. I'd suggest dropping Evocation, where you only really lose Magic Missile and Wind Wall.

Some thought on drifts:
Stage 1: As you said, there are only two plant-based choices. If you care, you could substitute "green and waxy (i.e plantlike) skin" for "green and scaly skin"
Stage 2: Photosynthesis is a given. Camel hump might be refluffed to storing water, cactus-like, which would effectively remove your need to eat and drink. Or you could just take sap for blood.
Stage 3: Thorns are fun. Antlers help with the "swamp thing/Merlin" aesthetic, and also give you a natural attack, handy for your full attack routine.
Stage 4: Acidic stinger could be an extension of thorns. More full-attack goodness! Pounce would be sweet, but it's not really character-apropriate. Ferocity could be an extension of sap for blood. Scent is also fun, but again, hard to justify.
Stage 5: Tree bark! Grow, AC, grow! A unicorn horn by any other name would still provide an extra natural attack and a bonus against poison. The hedgehog stuff, which might be a kind of hardening/hibernation of your wooden limbs, could be fun with Haste but feels kind of gimmicky. Tremorsense could be feeler roots. Blindsense is harder to explain but even more useful.

For a feat progression, I'd suggest something like this:

Wizard bonus: Scribe Scroll, Craft Wand
Human Bonus: Divine Vigor (Might seem like a random choice, but with a d6 average HD, some extra hit points are always nice. And since your turning doesn't really advance otherwise... Also it's good to be able to keep up in the dungeon even when you're wearing full plate.)
Lvl 1: Improved Initiative (You want the time to deploy your buffs.)
Lvl 3: Extend Spell (Prolongs the duration of buffs. Saves on spell slots in the long run)
Lvl 6: Possibly Quick Draw, since you'll be juggling wands, weapons and magical foci. Depends on how strict your GM is with that kind of thing.
Lvl 9: Brew Potion, so you can hand out buffs to the other PCs and don't have to do it all yourself. (This one is probably the most replaceable, if I've missed a feat you want)
Lvl 12: Arcane Strike. You probably won't have the spell slots to use it much at the beginning, but it's nice in a pinch and will only get more useful. (An alternative option is Improved Familiar, the Complete Warrior version. They actually make pretty good bodyguards, since you can share spells with them.)
Lvl 15: Persistent Spell (If it's the 3.0 version). Same as Extend Spell, but so much better! (If the DM says no, take Quicken instead.)
Lvl 18: Quicken Spell (Helps buff faster. Enables the Harm/Quickened Magic Missile trick, if that's your kind of thing.) (If you took Quicken at 15th and have 3 natural attacks from Drifts, take Multiattack here.)

If the DM does allow Mystic Theurge, I'd go with the Clr 3/Wiz 3/Geo 6 version, for more drifts. Also, it means you'll finish Geomancer quicker and can then go into Mystic Theurge, which will give your casting a much-needed boost. (You might want to consider interspersing levels of Mystic Theurge with Geomancer, if you find during the campaign that your casting progresses too slowly.)

In that case, I'd go with Clr 3/Wiz 3/Geomancer 8/Mystic Theurge 4, (Spell Versatility 9 is pretty silly, since there's no way to actually get 9th level spells before level 20 if you have it.) which gives you final caster levels of
clr 13 wiz 9 (Or Clr 11/wiz 11, if you prefer that. 6th level wizard slots are really useful, so it's a valid option.) by level 18 and still complete spell versatility.

If you've gotten him to approve that, you might get him to approve Practiced Spellcaster too (Complete Divine, same book as the updated Geomancer), which would allow you to play an actual dual spellcaster.

And in that case, prohibiting Conjuration instead of Transmutation begins to make sense again.

In which case, go with these feats:

Wizard Bonus: Scribe Scroll
Human Bonus: Improved Initiative
1: Spell Focus (school of your choice. Just make sure it's one where saves are important.)
3racticed Spellcaster (Wizard)
6: Practiced Spellcaster (Cleric)
9: Empower Spell (Keeps your damage up to par)
12 Craft Wand (You probably still want this)
15 Quicken Spell (And definitely this)
18 Spell Penetration (If you need it, which you probably will. Otherwise, Maximize Spell)

This version gets fewer drifts. I suggest:
Stage 1: It's cosmetic anyway. Go with the viny hair and the leafy skin.
Stage 2: Photosynthesis and tree sap blood. (On a reread, tree sap blood might be really good, if it works whenever you take ongoing damage (i.e when on fire, inside Acid Fog etc.)
Stage 3: Thorns are good for "leave me alone!" factor. Spinning webs might be cool. Could be fluffed as growing entangling creepers from your body, for extra Swamp Thing-ness.
Stage 4: Scent is the thing.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Hmmm...some interesting suggestions! In no particular order...

I'm not too worried about my overall count on high-level spells: I forgot to mention that the party has a single-classed Generalist Wiz. I'm thinking this guy's role is primarily Healer/Buffer, possibly with some summoning thrown in. The one thing I regret about choosing nature-themed Cleric over Druid is that the latter has Summon Nature's Ally. I know they have some overlap w/Summon Monster spells, but I'd love to have had the option...especially since that would expand the breadth of my spell selection.

Healing is where the Geomancer's strength will really show. Since I'll have a huge number of spells (just not high-level arcane ones), I'll be able to use Spell Versatility to spontaneously convert my arcane spells to heals. It will almost be like the party's traveling with a mobile hospital! They may not be big heals, but there will be lots of them. And, as of this writing, even my 3rd level spells will be bigger than anything the party has had on a regular basis.

On the feats, you've brought up some things I hadn't considered, so obviously, I'll have to do some thinking.

Instead of Brew Potion, though, I thought I'd take the very similar Brew Infusion (or whatever its called), mainly for flavor reasons. Instead of tossing someone a beaker, I can just pluck a berry or yank a tuber from my planty-self and say "Eat this!" (Yes, every double entendre you just read was intentional.) Its something Swamp Thing has done from time to time.

I'm not sure about other Crafting feats, though. The XP cost could get me in trouble. I was thinking more of Empower (works for healing & attack spells) or Extend (for buffs).

Others include possibly taking Reach Spell to heal/stabilize in combat from range (along with the odd attack or so), Improved Familiar to get an Earth Elemental.

Arcane Strike! I'd forgotten that one! That might come in handy.

Thanks, too, for the reskinnings of the Drift. I had been thinking along similar lines with the thorns & acid, but some of the others I hadn't considered.

I'm probably not going to follow the Geomancer path to its terminus. I'm thinking I'm going to want more Clc levels, if for no other reason than to improve my Turning. I'll probably alternate Clc levels with Geo (boosting Arcane & Divine in alternating levels).

I don't recognize Divine Power- what is that?

Race: Human, Dwarf, or Gnome? H's get the bonus Feat, Dwarves get the benefit of the Con bonus, Darkvision and so forth, Gnomes get some spell-like abilities and an AC bonus.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

BREAKING NEWS!

The DM has just sent out an email stating that he's updating the campaign to 3.5!

Still no final word on what sourcebooks are available. I may be able to get SERIOUSLY funky with this! Heritage feats...Reserve feats...hmmmm.

OTOH, this means that certain things will be nerfed, like the duration of certain buff spells, so Extend Spell may become even more key.

Edit: just got the list- PHB, Complete Warrior, Complete Divine, Complete Adventurer, and Complete Arcane. I can work with that.

 

[Theroc]

Well, no Reserve Feats then, but you could still do Draconic Heritage, I think, as they are in Complete Arcane.

I don't have any direct advice because I am not too familiar with building spellcasters, but I'd like to hear how this character works out, Danny.

 

[Asha'man]

Hmmm. That is good -it means Mystic Theurge and Practiced Spellcaster are in the bag. On the other hand it means you won't get to use Haste or Persistent Spell (Unless you go with Divine Metamagic, but that's rather tasteless if you ask me.)

I considered infusions too, but they're actually quite different from potions, if you read the fine print. They're actually much more like divine-only scrolls. People who can't cast divine spells are poisoned when they eat an infusion, instead of getting to activate the spell. That's why I didn't suggest it.

I'll gladly help you more later, but for the moment I'm somewhat busy.

Edit: And Divine Power is a 4th level cleric spell which gives amazing combat bonuses. It's arguably broken, in fact. But it's right there in the PHB.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I had chosen infusions because of the flavor, and in 3Ed, they were a lot more like potions.

As it turns out, I don't think infusions are in any of the sources I'm able to use anyway. If I take Brew Potion, I'm still going to try to go the "berries & tubers" route, if the DM doesn't object. They do describe such things in CompArc, after all.

As a Support Specialist, the most important Metamagic feat will probably be Extend spell- I'm not worried about beating saves, SR and the like, for the most part.

I'm not sure adding Mystic Theurge to the mix is going to help me all that much. Yes, it boosts both Clc & Wiz at the same time, but I won't get any boost to my Turning, my # of Feats, and gets tricky with that Spell Versatility ability.

I'm planning on taking Practiced Spellcaster for both Clc and Wiz. That will make him effectively Clc11/Wiz9 for casting purposes.

I like the Draconic Heritage feats, but I'm leaving them alone this time around- they're Sorc only. But the real reason I'm not using them is that I used them last campaign for my Mage-Brute build. Otherwise, I might just dump the SpecWiz and go Sorc with this build.

Hmmm...I say that...but can anyone help with a list of pros/cons the Sorc (assuming I go with the Draco feats) gives me compared to the SpecWiz in this build?

Pros:

1. A few more spell slots- if nothing else, this means more cure spells due to Geomancer Spell Versatility,
2. The Draconic Breath as an offensive channel, and other Draconic feats have some nice benefits
3. Situational flexibility,
4. Cha as a casting stat synergizes with the Clc who uses it for Turning. Edit: this would also make Divine Feats much more viable.

Cons:

1. Fewer spells known,
2. Qualifiy for Geomancer 1 level lower- probable build Clc3/Sorc4/Geo5, caster levels Clc6/Sorc6 (Clc10/Sorc10 w/Practiced Spellcaster)
3. 2 fewer feats (no free Scribe Scroll, no bonus metamagic)
4. Fewer class skills