Level Up (A5E) A5e versions of O5e archetypes in a post-OGL world

xiphumor

Hero
So the AG clearly includes several archetypes that are intended to replace the archetypes from O5e. To give just a few examples:

Wizards
All 8 subclasses -> Arcanist archetype

Druid
Circle of Land -> Guardian
Circle of the Moon -> Skinchanger

Warlock
Archfey -> Spellbound
Fiend -> Diabolist
Great Old One -> Alienist

At the same time, the sense is that because A5e is reverse compatible with O5e, continuing to reinvent archetypes in this way is not an ideal use of time and resources. At the very least, this seems to be the stance of the GPG, and I approve. I prefer expanding the range of resources rather than trying to just replace O5e.

However, now that the OGL debacle has broken, that calculus might have shifted, and some players might prefer to see reinventions of O5e subclasses from a 3PP rather than getting those options from WotC products. I wanted to start a discussion as to how Level Up might handle this sea change in this respect.

I for one would probably say “hold the course” as far as the policy of the GPG and new official materials, but there may be some room for 3PPs to reimagine how these old subclasses work: ESPECIALLY the ones that weren’t executed particularly well.

E.g.
The Four Elements Monk
The Nature Cleric
The Alchemist Artificer
The Undying Warlock
 

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For me what I would like to see is Artificer support. The subclasses in gpg0 are nice but would love to see all of the core artificer subclasses get a revamp especially since the core class feels so different.

Besides that the 4 elements adept is a must. I would also love to see an eldritch knight that is not just a feat chain for a5e.

There is a great 3rd party arcane Archer and hexblade style warlock from purple martin games. There is also a hexblade style warlock in GPG but honestly I like purple martins better.
 

kerleth

Explorer
Edit: Just realized this doesn't actually have anything to do with the specific post and just falls under the same general "classes needing support" bucket. I apologize for that.

Savant support. It's a class idea that keeps getting reinvented again and again because people keep wanting to do something like that and it's a space that isn't adequately filled by core books. While I realize it isn't in the Adventurer's Guide which can cause issues, that is not an insurmountable problem. Just put one archetype, selection of class abilities, or multiclassing feats in every magazine or two. People who don't have the setting book won't be missing out on much, because there is still everything else in the Gazette, and it acts as advertising for the Adventures in Zeitgeist campaign setting book for people who are intrigued by what they see. Heck, there is nothing stopping the class entire from being added as bonus material in something like the Gatepass Gazette Annual Compilation, or in a City and Society themed book ala the Dungeon Delver's Guide.

Not having supporting material is always one of the big problems with new classes. I'm not sure if Savant is open for 3pp to design for, some memory is tickling me saying it's not. But that is even more reason for something "official" to be worked out to support it. The Gatepass Gazette might require some sort of altered setup for those articles, maybe doing them more "in house" with specific different contracts and presenting them alongside the normal submissions, or perhaps putting the support in some other sort of supplement if that is overly difficult, or just changing that and adding Savant to the things that can be supported alongside a re-release or bonus content sort of deal perhaps. That's assuming I'm correct in that memory. Regardless of any of that, the Savant definitely can use more support whatever form that takes.
 

I remember from some past threads people keep wanting to make witches. You could stat that out.

Also, the Dex-y fighter--the swashbuckler, the pistoleer, the archer. To some degree this is covered by the monk/martial artist, but they fight unarmed.

And name the monk the 'martial artist'. Most cloistered monastic types outside of the Shaolin monastery can't fight all that well. It also opens up the possibility of a FF-'white mage'-like priest who specializes in healing magic--not much good in combat, but double the healing.
 

xiphumor

Hero
Edit: Just realized this doesn't actually have anything to do with the specific post and just falls under the same general "classes needing support" bucket. I apologize for that.

Savant support. It's a class idea that keeps getting reinvented again and again because people keep wanting to do something like that and it's a space that isn't adequately filled by core books. While I realize it isn't in the Adventurer's Guide which can cause issues, that is not an insurmountable problem. Just put one archetype, selection of class abilities, or multiclassing feats in every magazine or two. People who don't have the setting book won't be missing out on much, because there is still everything else in the Gazette, and it acts as advertising for the Adventures in Zeitgeist campaign setting book for people who are intrigued by what they see. Heck, there is nothing stopping the class entire from being added as bonus material in something like the Gatepass Gazette Annual Compilation, or in a City and Society themed book ala the Dungeon Delver's Guide.

Not having supporting material is always one of the big problems with new classes. I'm not sure if Savant is open for 3pp to design for, some memory is tickling me saying it's not. But that is even more reason for something "official" to be worked out to support it. The Gatepass Gazette might require some sort of altered setup for those articles, maybe doing them more "in house" with specific different contracts and presenting them alongside the normal submissions, or perhaps putting the support in some other sort of supplement if that is overly difficult, or just changing that and adding Savant to the things that can be supported alongside a re-release or bonus content sort of deal perhaps. That's assuming I'm correct in that memory. Regardless of any of that, the Savant definitely can use more support whatever form that takes.
1. Savants and Artificers were actually added to the SRD for A5e, so 3PPs are free to make material for them.

2. You should keep a very, very close eye out for GPG #12 ;)
 

xiphumor

Hero
I remember from some past threads people keep wanting to make witches. You could stat that out.

Also, the Dex-y fighter--the swashbuckler, the pistoleer, the archer. To some degree this is covered by the monk/martial artist, but they fight unarmed.

And name the monk the 'martial artist'. Most cloistered monastic types outside of the Shaolin monastery can't fight all that well. It also opens up the possibility of a FF-'white mage'-like priest who specializes in healing magic--not much good in combat, but double the healing.
I’m not sure if you’ve noticed, but this is an A5e thread, where the Monk was already renamed the Adept.
 




Even with resources like Wikidot available that give you that content for free?
i don’t know what wikidot is, and i’m not sayin’ i absolutely won’t allow or include (pre-owned and free) WOTC content, yet it takes a huge effort to convert a campaign, and socially to get all players on board—so i prefer to be nearly 100% Level Up as far as character creation. (+ 3PP 5e adventures).
 

xiphumor

Hero
i don’t know what wikidot is, and i’m not sayin’ i absolutely won’t allow or include (pre-owned and free) WOTC content, yet it takes a huge effort to convert a campaign, and socially to get all players on board—so i prefer to be nearly 100% Level Up as far as character creation. (+ 3PP 5e adventures).
This is wikidot: Frontpage - DND 5th Edition It has pretty much all of the O5e character building options, including UA.

See, I actually found it much easier to convince players to come on board with A5e when I let them know that they could still use certain O5e options. Then again, your table, your rules.
 


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