Adding spells to an NPC without classes.

[Oryan77]

I'm trying to understand monster creation a little better.

I've seen creatures that say, "casts spells as an 8th lvl casster" or similar. How does it work when you want an NPC to cast spells but not actually be a level in a caster class?

I'm wanting to take a Ratatosk from the new Expedition to the Demonweb Pits and make him a leader type. I don't exactly want him to be a Druid class because I want him to only be a couple of CRs higher, & giving him 1 or 2 levels in Druid will only give him 1st level spells. What are the rules for making a lower level creature cast spells as a higher level caster? In this case, maybe only as high as casting 3rd lvl spells.

 

[TessarrianDM]

There are no caster level advancement rules in the Monster Manual, but dragons gain two caster levels for every three hit dice gained according to their charts.

 

[moritheil]

I'm trying to understand monster creation a little better.

I've seen creatures that say, "casts spells as an 8th lvl casster" or similar. How does it work when you want an NPC to cast spells but not actually be a level in a caster class?

I'm wanting to take a Ratatosk from the new Expedition to the Demonweb Pits and make him a leader type. I don't exactly want him to be a Druid class because I want him to only be a couple of CRs higher, & giving him 1 or 2 levels in Druid will only give him 1st level spells. What are the rules for making a lower level creature cast spells as a higher level caster? In this case, maybe only as high as casting 3rd lvl spells.

I've actually never wanted that. However, per monster advancement rules, you can just stick in a few SLAs and eyeball the CR. (See Monster of Legend for a similar trick; it's a template that grants casting as a 5th level cleric.)

 

[pawsplay]

Obviously, it's less useful than actual levels, and definitely not as useful as "nonassociated caster levels." So i'd say probably +1 CR per three caster levels, until caster level equals their CR, then +1 CR per two.

That would make a gnoll who casts as a 20th level sorcerer around CR 10. That's a ridiculous example, but insofar as you could assign a CR to such a thing, it feels about right.

 

[Nifft]

In general:

1/ Don't give spells that a single-class caster of the same level as his CR couldn't cast.

2/ Don't give too many spells -- he's not going to be alive very long once he starts casting them, right?

Cheers, -- N

 

[pawsplay]

In general:

1/ Don't give spells that a single-class caster of the same level as his CR couldn't cast.

I was about to argue with that, as a number of monsters have higher level spells. However, it usually relates to their basic schtick, and some care has been taken to balance them in other ways. Slapping high level spells onto a creature that already has its own suite of abilities is probably a recipe for disaster.

 

[Quartz]

How about giving him a Ring of Spell Storing with the required spells?

 

[Diirk]

I was about to argue with that, as a number of monsters have higher level spells. However, it usually relates to their basic schtick, and some care has been taken to balance them in other ways. Slapping high level spells onto a creature that already has its own suite of abilities is probably a recipe for disaster.

See the steel dragon for an example of this *shudder*