D&D 3E/3.5 Alienist[3.5] - Complete Arcane - Any Changes?

[Herremann the Wise]

Hello Everyone,

To any who are currently holding the Complete Arcane in their hands.

Unfortunately, I won't be able to get the Complete Arcane for another week or so here in Australia. However being a rather desperate individual, I need to know if they have changed too much around compared to the Alienist in Tome and Blood.

I have already made the 3.5 changes to the Psuedonatural Template as per the Manual of the Planes 3.5 update. I'm interested if they have changed the Alienist level abilities around at all.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Hello Everyone,

[tap, tap, tap] is this thing on?
Ummm... anyone?

I'll give you some smilies .
Lot's of them. I'm desperate. Just a quick note is all I need.
[pleading on knees] I really really really need to know [/pleading on knees]

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Tessarael]

Alienist
- Alienist level stacks with Wizard or Sorcerer levels for familiar
- Mad Certainty penalty is now -4 Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal instead of phobia
- Insane Certainty penalty is now -10 Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal instead of phobia
- Alien Transcendence DR is 10/magc and resistance is acid/electricity 10

 

[Olive]

Alienist
- Alienist level stacks with Wizard or Sorcerer levels for familiar
- Mad Certainty penalty is now -4 Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal instead of phobia
- Insane Certainty penalty is now -10 Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal instead of phobia
- Alien Transcendence DR is 10/magc and resistance is acid/electricity 10

Hmmm. The familiar thing will please my player, but I'm not sure I'll take the phobia out.

 

[Aesmael]

Those phobias certainly sounded more fun than a straight penalty. If anyone would care to give a rundown of how they worked... ?

Normally I wouldn't ask, but since they seem to be ditching it, well.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Alienist
- Alienist level stacks with Wizard or Sorcerer levels for familiar
- Mad Certainty penalty is now -4 Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal instead of phobia
- Insane Certainty penalty is now -10 Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal instead of phobia
- Alien Transcendence DR is 10/magc and resistance is acid/electricity 10

[RANT ON] Damn it. An alienist without a phobia is like...
What would Mostin be without his avian phobia? Huh?
This is a disgrace!
-4/-10 to Bluff/Diplomacy/Handle Animal is small potatoes. -2/-6 to attacks and DC's was far worse.[/RANT OFF]

Oh well. I'm sure everyone will still be playing their Alienists with manic phobia anyway. It's just too much fun.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Stormrunner]

There are some important changes.

The new Alienist has Alignment: any nonlawful. (I don't really agree with this; in many Lovecraftian stories (which is what they're trying to recreate with the Alienist) it's an obsession with math or science that leads the unfortunate narrator to discover Colors Man Was Not Meant To Know and the like.)
You now need only Knowledge: the planes 8 ranks - Knowledge:arcana 8 ranks has been dropped.
You now only need to know at least one 3rd-level summoning spell - knowing a 3rd-level divination spell has been dropped.
The required feat has changed from Alertness to Augment Summoning (which has a prerequisite, Spell Focus:Conjuration, that they fail to mention. Sloppy.)
The alienist no longer gets Alchemy, Handle Animal, or Speak Language as class skills.

Under the old rules for the Mad Certainty class feature, the DM would pick a type of creature ("snakes, spiders, birds, or insects" are suggested), and the alienist then gets a -2 to saving throws, attack rolls, and Charisma-based skill and ability checks vs. that type of critter. The critter likewise gets a +2 to AC and saving throws vs. the alienist. With Insane Certainty these numbers increase to -6/+6.
Under the new rules, the alienist gets a -4 on Bluff, Diplomacy, and Handle Animal checks, rising to -10 with Insane Certainty. (The Handle Animal penalty doesn't apply to pseudonatural critters.)

I've never been happy with the "certainty" features, and the changes didn't improve things any IMO. Woo hoo, an extra 6 hit points. I think I'll run right out and engage in melee now. In exchange you get an ocassionally-crippling phobia (3.0) or a complete lack of social skills (3.5). Apparently in 3.5 all alienists are antisocial loners (another assumption not borne out by the literature: the artist Pickham, for example, was popular (and described as having "a strange, febrile charisma") despite his eccentricities and the disturbing nature of his paintings). No cabals of Cthulhu-worshippers here, nope. I would have been happier to see somthing like Mad Certainty: +2 to Will saves; Insane Certainty: +4 to Will saves, +2 to Fort saves.

 

[Staffan]

The new Alienist has Alignment: any nonlawful. (I don't really agree with this; in many Lovecraftian stories (which is what they're trying to recreate with the Alienist) it's an obsession with math or science that leads the unfortunate narrator to discover Colors Man Was Not Meant To Know and the like.)

Since when does alignment have anything to do with interest in math/science?

 

[Plane Sailing]

In 3.0 I mad certainty a +2 Cha bonus and insane certainty a +4 Cha bonus, with the appropriate phobias. I think I'll probably continue with this in my campaign.

I like alienist as a more sorcerer-friendly class, and I like the idea of charismatic alienists, full of their own mad certainty, setting up cabals in unlikely places

 

[Altamont Ravenard]

Since when does alignment have anything to do with interest in math/science?

Well, rigueur could be interpreted as akin to lawfulness.

AR