Allowing PCs to choose which skills are class skills?

[Desert Hare]

I wonder how unbalancing it would be to allow characters to select which skills they want as class skills.

I think Knowledge should include all specialties since some classes already get all Knowledge skills as class skills.

Basically the characters could choose a # of skills as class skills equal to four times the # shown on Table 4-1.

For example, a barbarian could choose 12 skills as class skills.

 

[Sempronius]

I like it.
You could have sneaky fighters, but because of their low skill points, wouldn't be able to do much else (though what can they do RAW? ride horsies and climb walls...)
You could have sneaky wizards (who needs sneak attack when you have a supprise fireball?)
You could have sneaky clerics (evil cleric, hiding in the shadows, bolstering undead...)
You could have a sneaky paladin (on second thought...)
You get the drift.
It will turn into magical medieval Metal Gear... Or, knowing most gamers, something more like Tenchu: hide to kill easier, rather than hide to not be seen while you infiltrate.

It would be fun. Want to try this out next chance I get.

 

[Nonlethal Force]

Or, you could just get rid of class skills altogether like our group does. You want to take a rank in a skill, go for it. Who really cares?

Realistically, it makes sense. Take any occupation. You can find members of that occupation who have talents/interest/hobbies in just about any area of life.

The only consideration is to game balance in respect to PrCs. But honestly, I don't think that matters.

The upside to no class skills is that your skill total always ends up with the amount of skill ranks you spent. You never have to worry about which ones count as 1 and which ones count as 2. And in my book, that's a good thing!

 

[Celebrim]

I have a homebrew advantage/disadvantage system.

One of the advantages that you can take is 'Unusual Background'. The benefit of having this trait is that you can choose three skills which are not class exclusive that are always class skills for a particular class. All you have to do to qualify is make up some idea that links the skills.

So, for example, you might take 'Unusual Background: Martial Artist', that makes tumble, balance, and concentrate class skills for your fighter.

Or you might take 'Unusual Background: Gutter Mage', that makes sleight of hand, hide, and spot class skills for your wizard.

It wouldn't be unbalancing to make 'Unusual Background' a Trait or even a Feat.

This works particularly well because I have no PrC's (hate them), so there aren't any balance issues.

I don't particularly like your idea. It seems to me that few classes are ever going to want to dabble in more than 12 or so skills.

In particular, what I think would always happen in the long run is that every class would choose the uber-skills as class skills: tumble, use magic device(!!!), spot, listen, and bluff and probably round those five out (if they had any points to spare) with some combination of search, escape artist, move silently, sense motive... and you notice I haven't even got to 12 yet? You'd end up with a whole circus filled with bouncy, highly alert, quiet, fast-talking, escape artists, some of whom were good at searching and noticing when someone was lying.

But, to each their own. If it works for you, it works for you.

 

[slwoyach]

Just throw out the whole cross-class skill bologna. The game runs much better without it.

 

[Sempronius]

About cross-class:

Realistically, it makes sense. Take any occupation. You can find members of that occupation who have talents/interest/hobbies in just about any area of life.

I disagree. Those with talents/interests/hobbies are unlikely to be as trained, or capable in them as they are in their main line of work. If they were, they would likely be following that as their occupation.
I'd probably stat out as an average Lv.1 commoner, and have an interest in history. I am not trained professionally (that is, I didn't go to uni, but do devote a lot of my time to reading) so I would not have Know(History) as a class skill, even though I used all available skill points on it:4 skill points, resulting in two ranks.
Someone who has been taught professionally, has access to the best/most current works/journals/whatever and has put the same amount of effort into it (4 skill points) would be much better than myself, with a total of 4 skill points at 1st level.
I could do something to raise my skill (not ranks) in Know(history) like take a summer course at a uni or something, while still not taking it into my life fully, and this would likely give a similar bonus to Skill Focus.
So it does reflect reality that way.
Whether you find that reflection fun or not, that is a different question.

As far as fun and gaming are concerned, though, I like the 'choose your class skills' idea.
However, as pointed out above, skills wouldn't vary much between characters. Maybe it would be better to allow each character to pick a number of cross class skills to be treated as class skills:
Barbarian....1
Bard...........3
Cleric..........1
Druid..........1
Fighter........2
Monk..........2
Paladin........1
Ranger........2
Rogue.........3
Sorcerer......1
Wizard........1

That way, you have to stay witin your class range, but you get some leeway. The odd thing about this, is that the more class skills a class has, the less they need the extra class skills...
You could do it another way: Everone gets to choose two cross class skills that they can treat as class skills. Humans, instead, get three. You might, instead, decide that instead of getting an extra two or three skills, the character swaps class skills for cross class skills. This gives a little more complexity and individuality to characters: They may choose the same cross class skills to learn, but they give up different class skills, or the opposite: they gave up the same class skills, butt chose different cross class skills to learn.

Just a (few) thought(s).

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Or, you could just get rid of class skills altogether like our group does. You want to take a rank in a skill, go for it. Who really cares?

Yeah, this. "Cross-class" is such an abstraction that trying to rationalize it with any kind of fluff is like imitating the poetry of T.S. Eliot. Cross-class skills exist mostly for the purpose of pigeonholing PCs of certain classes into certain archetypes, and a little bit for class balance. I myself only restrict Hide, Listen, MS and Spot to cross-class status for balance purposes; all other skills are class skills for everyone.

TS [not Eliot, thank god!]

 

[Desert Hare]

Thanks for all the input. I've decided to just eliminate cross-class skills.

Skills which are class skills will get a +1 training bonus.

 

[Drowbane]

Or, you could just get rid of class skills altogether like our group does. You want to take a rank in a skill, go for it. Who really cares?

The only consideration is to game balance in respect to PrCs. But honestly, I don't think that matters.

QFT!
We do this as well. Additionally we give each class +2 skills (fighters, wizards, and clerics are 4+int, rogues have an amazing 10+int) and combine some skills (Stealth, Perception being quite popular choices).

 

[concerro]

Pc chosen skills

This is a good idea, and I thought about it. Sometimes I am to much of a slave to the rules. I will run this by my players.