Alter Self too powerful?

[The Souljourner]

I just started a bard last night (of course the first thing we fight is an ooze, and I forgot my missile weapons... great), and decided to cast alter self.

Now, being the bard that I am, I don't want to go around looking like a troglodyte, which is why it's handy I also have a hat of disguise... change my form to trog, but I still look like my beautiful self... sweet!

So anyway... +6 natural armor, plus a few natural weapons... this sounds too good for a 2nd level spell.

..and yet, there it is in black and white. for 10 minutes per level, I get +6 natural armor. That puts my bard with a +2 chain shirt and +2 buckler up to 30 AC at 9th level. Yeouch.

So... what do you all think? I know this has been brought up before, but I'd like to hear again now that people have played 3.5 for a while.

-The Souljourner

 

[DM2]

Its certainly a nice defensive spell, but as a DM I don't have any issue with the 9th level bard in my party floating his AC up close to 30.

He does it, but I don't have a real issue with it. I guess I'm happy to see some really useful spells on his list these days.

DM2

 

[The Souljourner]

But what about the 4th level bard who gets 6 natural armor bonus?

Don't get me wrong, I like the spell and I want to keep it, I just feel a little dirty doing it.

-The Souljourner

 

[Darklone]

Personally I don't like the combination with Disguise Self...

And I don't like the automatic proficiency with natural weapons.

 

[The Souljourner]

I thought the combination with disguise self was ingenious. I just happened to have a hat of disguise (all bards should - neverending wardrobe!), and realized that I could use alter self without having to look ridiculous (or rather, more ridiculous than most bards already are).

As for natural weapons... what's the big deal? It's biting and scratching, not exactly rocket science here.

-The Souljourner

 

[hazmat]

I like the combo with the hat of disguise but I don't like the proficiency with natural weapons.

If your character has seen a troglodyte before that taking the form would be ok. Like druids I think you should only be able to take forms that you are familiar with.

 

[DM2]

I like the combo with the hat of disguise but I don't like the proficiency with natural weapons.

If your character has seen a troglodyte before that taking the form would be ok. Like druids I think you should only be able to take forms that you are familiar with.

That restriction also pretty much melts away. Superior forms like troglodyte would almost certainly be taught to the wizard by his mentor along with the spell itself.

Depends on the campaign world and frequency of troglodytes I suppose. If they were just a myth that hardly ever reveals itself, maybe the form wouldn't be known and taught...

DM2

 

[The Souljourner]

Well, our group has met plenty of troglodytes before, so that's not a problem.


(And bards rarely have magical mentors, I would think.... unless you're talking like a bardic college... *shrug*)

-The Souljourner

 

[Jeph]

Alter Self is NOT Polymorph self. It does not affect "attack rolls, natural armor bonus, and saves," to quote from the SRD. At most it can give you a Fly speed of 30' or gills, I'd guess natural attacks are on par with that. However, it does not allow you to completely assume the form of another creature.

EDIT: But Alter Self rocks anyway, just because it lets my barbarian/sorcerer turn into a winged jet black demon with glowing red tattooes.

 

[jgsugden]

This is a rather 'optimal' use of the spell. In fact, besides troglodyte, the spell gives you little benefit.

If you find the trog form to be too powerful, you might consider rewriting trogs as monstrous humanoids. They'd have different saves and a +1 to their BAB, but beyond that, little else would change.