Alternate PDF Sales Outlets

[DSC-EricPrice]

IMHO we have something strange going on in the RPG industry and I wonder if it was done on purpose, or was in fact an accident.

In this industry we (the publishers) are setting the prices, not the retailer (be it DTRPG or RPGNow). That is completely backward to traditional methods, which allowed retailers some flexibility in setting prices in the hopes of attracting customers. That type of system TYPICALLY leads to retailers continuing to lower prices until the profit margins are so thin that no one can really compete (from a retailer perspective). I THINK thats why DTRPG initially thought they needed exclusivity agreements, and why theyve backed off of them now. With our current method, we need not worry that retailers will face economic hardship because of competitive pricing wars. If you consider it RPGNow is A LOT less like a retailer and more like an outsourced store (with a place in the "mall" so that traffic is MUCH higher than it might be otherwise).

Why would an RPG company have its own store then? Simple. We want the other 30%, and the barriers to entry for making a store (particularly with Paypal) are virtually nil. Even a professional store made with that OpenCart software that Dragon Scale Counters used to use is relatively inexpensive. We paid just $15 a month to host the MySQL backend and run the store.

With this model then if there is a market for another RPG material "retailer" its business plan lies in cuts in the charges a retailer is willing to make to the publisher. Cuts alone are not enough though given the HUGE start RPGNow has on any late comers. A would-be retailer might become popular based on the removal of the minimum order, which lets face it has bit all of us at one time or another, and I think Im reading that that is exactly what the other guy is trying. Another idea might be to get tied in more tightly with another RPG new site with a lot of traffic. Only time will tell if the late comers will be successful. One thing is for sure. Unless publishers are forced into exclusivity agreements or receive a discount for being "exclusive" then they have no real reason to NOT advertise and sell in every store on the web that will take their product.

 

[Mark]

IMHO we have something strange going on in the RPG industry and I wonder if it was done on purpose, or was in fact an accident.

In this industry we (the publishers) are setting the prices, not the retailer (be it DTRPG or RPGNow). That is completely backward to traditional methods, which allowed retailers some flexibility in setting prices in the hopes of attracting customers. That type of system TYPICALLY leads to retailers continuing to lower prices until the profit margins are so thin that no one can really compete (from a retailer perspective).

If by "industry" you mean the segment of the industry devoted to the selling of virtual products, it's because there is a lack of physical product, and therefore no capital outlay by the e-tailer that the relationship between e-tailer and publisher manifests differently than that of the three tier system of publisher/manufacturer, distributor, and retailer. It would be difficult for an e-tailer to justify to the publisher a reduction in price (without consent) when he has no physical product to move. It's the need to liquidate and acquire more current stock that drives the price reductions in brick-and-mortar operations.

 

[johnsemlak]

OKay, so it seems that multiple sales outlets are good for exposure and don't really seem to hurt one another. So the next question is: What are the other sales outlets out there?

There's, to my knowledge:
DTRPG.com
CreationCrash.com (though I don't know if any vendor can request to join or if it's by invitation--Phil?)
Own Webshop (which I can set up via PayPal with little problem).

What else? I seem to recall that Atlas would be opening a PDF version of their Warehouse 23 store, but haven't seen anything yet. Is there anyone else?

SV Games?

 

[DSC-EricPrice]

If by "industry" you mean the segment of the industry devoted to the selling of virtual products, it's because there is a lack of physical product, and therefore no capital outlay by the e-tailer that the relationship between e-tailer and publisher manifests differently than that of the three tier system of publisher/manufacturer, distributor, and retailer. It would be difficult for an e-tailer to justify to the publisher a reduction in price (without consent) when he has no physical product to move. It's the need to liquidate and acquire more current stock that drives the price reductions in brick-and-mortar operations.

Not that I disagree with you, but how does that explain the digital music industry then? Like the pdf market it has no physical product, yet the price you pay for a given song can vary from .49 to as much as $2.00 a song and more.

 

[jmucchiello]

Not that I disagree with you, but how does that explain the digital music industry then? Like the pdf market it has no physical product, yet the price you pay for a given song can vary from .49 to as much as $2.00 a song and more.

Because most e-pubs/e-tailers are not traditional pubs/retailers and thus aren't beholden to the 3-tier system. Whereas in the song trade, most of the players in the scene are the same players in the physical market.

I'm sure the reason companies like WotC sell current DRM books at list price (when then sell them) is because even WotC doesn't want to anger their distributers by undercutting the list price.

 

[Warden]

SV Games?

I looked into these guys over a year ago and they're looking at 40%-50% cuts on sales. Mind you, that may have changed since then, but it forces a rather large increase in price that would make it irrelevant to bother trying.

 

[Morrus]

I looked into these guys over a year ago and they're looking at 40%-50% cuts on sales. Mind you, that may have changed since then, but it forces a rather large increase in price that would make it irrelevant to bother trying.

As a note about SV Games, EN Publishing's experience with them has not been good. They've had some of our product available for over two years now, and we have never once received a payment or even a sales report. Neither have we received replies to emails and phone messages asking them to remove our products from their catalog.

 

[FoolishFrost]

As a note about SV Games, EN Publishing's experience with them has not been good. They've had some of our product available for over two years now, and we have never once received a payment or even a sales report. Neither have we received replies to emails and phone messages asking them to remove our products from their catalog.

That sounds like grounds for legal action, and I don't say that lightly...

 

[Warden]

As a note about SV Games, EN Publishing's experience with them has not been good. They've had some of our product available for over two years now, and we have never once received a payment or even a sales report. Neither have we received replies to emails and phone messages asking them to remove our products from their catalog.

They never even responded to an email that I sent asking for more details, so that made them null and void, regardless of the percentage they were asking for.

For you guys, Morrus, you might not even have to look at legal action. Just a press release stating that EN Publishing will no longer make their products available at SV Games due to disagreements and issues with payment and then list anywhere else fine ENP products are sold. Considering the huge traffic that you guys have, that should be enough to spread the word and cause a bit of difficulty for SV.

You know what they say about bad press.

 

[philreed]

As a note about SV Games, EN Publishing's experience with them has not been good. They've had some of our product available for over two years now, and we have never once received a payment or even a sales report. Neither have we received replies to emails and phone messages asking them to remove our products from their catalog.

Makes me very happy that I never signed their contract.