D&D General Alternate thought - rule of cool is bad for gaming

[Aldarc]

A simpler game, however, does not automatically translate into "rulings not rules" being the order of the day. There are all kinds of ways a game can be simpler that don't toss most of the decision making into their lap.

As I've noted, you can have a much simpler game by having less exception based design, just as a basic example. D&D has never been that game.

No disagreement from me here. My point was that I just don't think that "rulings not rules" somehow was the One Thing that made or broke the success of 5e.

 

[Maxperson]

I would only disagree with the point that there aren’t other outliers. The DMG discusses success at a cost in its section concerning DMing.

Which kind of reinforces @pemerton ’s point: when you makes a skill roll, and you roll poorly, you might fail, or you might critically fail, or you might succeed at a cost, and fail/succeed at a cost may be independent of whether you just miss the DC or you miss substantially.

Yes and no. I'm speaking from the default rules standpoint. The success with a cost is an option that the DM can add, not the defaul position of ability checks. Such an addition does change the process, yes.

 

[Lanefan]

Those are all DM extras. 5e inherently only has jump goes distance. What is on the other side could affect the DC, but it would be in addition to the DC for X extra feet which has no process. Is it enough for arms to grab on? DM extra that has no bearing on jump distance. Height? DM extra that has no bearing on jump distance in 5e as halflings with 10 strength go as far as goliaths with 10 strength.

I read it as referring to difference in height between one side of the chasm and the other being one of many possible variables the DM would have to consider.

 

[Lanefan]

It doesn’t. Most players are able to separate what they know from what their characters believe.

My experience from both sides of the screen loudly says the exact opposite.

 

[Micah Sweet]

It doesn’t. Most players are able to separate what they know from what their characters believe.

I disagree. I think a lot of folks would have a hard time intentionally having their characters act on bad information (since they know they failed the roll). Far easier just to use hidden rolls.

 

[Maxperson]

I read it as referring to difference in height between one side of the chasm and the other being one of many possible variables the DM would have to consider.

Oh. Then that's just distance or using the high jump rules, depending on how much higher. Or it could be distance to get across and a separate check to catch the higher edge. Any way you cut it, though, it's an extra that doesn't alter the roll for distance.

 

[Maxperson]

I disagree. I think a lot of folks would have a hard time intentionally having their characters act on bad information (since they know they failed the roll). Far easier just to use hidden rolls.

The folks I have played with since 2000, and that's several dozen, have for the most part had no trouble doing that. There are only two that I can think of that couldn't or wouldn't.

 

[pemerton]

Lots of RPGs list 'actions per round' or something like that. And a lot of players feel that they can only to those actions.

Which RPGs do you have in mind?

 

[bloodtide]

Which RPGs do you have in mind?

Any one that has a list of actions that can be done during the game.

 

[Lanefan]

Oh. Then that's just distance or using the high jump rules, depending on how much higher. Or it could be distance to get across and a separate check to catch the higher edge. Any way you cut it, though, it's an extra that doesn't alter the roll for distance.

I'd say it would alter the roll for distance if the far side is, say, 5 feet lower. Case by case in any event, though.