Am I breaking any rules with this tactic?

[Hussar]

I'd agree with this. Although I don't think Hussars Idea of 2 standard actions is very overpowered.

Just curious , why do you feel the need to move into the room? Why not fight from the doorway? As long as you can see the enemy, you can shoot them. Plus they can only come at you one at a time through the doorway.

Well, moving into the room has an obvious advantage. If you fight from the doorway, only one or two (at most 3) PC's can melee. One on one is not a tactical advantage. By entering the room, flanking the door with the rogue in the center, I leave clear lanes of fire for both the priest (Korbach) and the wizard (Dhavyn) to blast away and have the backup of the two fighter types (Mel and Lorna) standing beside the finger wigglers. The rogue (Haz) anchors the whole deal in the center with a nice clear lane of fire for a bow. No one gets in anyone else's way to provide cover and no one is charging into the room to screw up area of effect spells. Everyone gets a nice ranged attack off, and we're in very good position to deal with the rest of the bad guys. If things go south, we can always escape back out the door. I've seen far too many combats where one or two PC's block the doorway and fight with the bad guys leaving the rest of the party to twiddle their thumbs because they can't reach/see the enemy. Remember, the door might be to the side of the hallway, not directly a the end, meaning that the party might mostly be behind the wall, not at the doorway.

I was hoping to bring maximum firepower to bear for the entire party, rather than relying on one or two PC's to do all the work. Because the PC's are paired up, it's a simple adjustment to flank opponents, and, with the wall behind them and an ally beside, it's nearly impossible to be flanked back, at least in the opening rounds anyway.

Like was said, guaranteeing a tactic is not really groovy. I'll just have to be satisfied with hoping for a good initiative roll. Thank you for the feedback guys. I confess I wasn't really sure if my idea was kosher or not and I'll show this thread to my DM so he can see what everyone thinks.

 

[Odysseus]

With that sized group your always going to have problems moving to gain maximum firepower/attacks to bear. What might help is a better mix of weapons, espeically reach weapons, that you can put in a 2nd rank, behind other characters.

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

Here's how I would do it:

1-Party preps for combat outside door.
2-Door is kicked down.
<Initiative is rolled, assuming hostiles on the other side>
3 (round 1) - It's likely the party gets a surprise round to move or attack. Ideally, melee fighters should delay their action until the ranged combatants have softened up the enemy.
4 (round 2) - attacks occur in initiative order.

As a party you can still get good usage out of that surprise round - archers can fire, spells can be cast, and fighters can close to combat. Fighters could charge into combat if they've got a clear line.

Giving the party any more advantage than this would be too much. This is enough.

 

[Baragos]

Hussah: If you want them to be able to do this, make it a teamwork benefit with some fairly annoying requirements...if they really want to be able to do as you want, they'll make sure to meet the requirements.

Off the top of my hat: Improved Initiative and Combat Reflexes for the leader. Combat Reflexes for everyone else...

 

[Hussar]

^ That might be a way to go.

To answer the question, the party consists of the 5 characters named. However, I've seen many instances where the fighter wins initiative, charges into the room and ignores the archer rogue or the two spell casters. Or, other instances where everyone tries to go in too many directions at once and nothing gets accomplished. My hope was to make a fairly standard tactic that we could follow as a group and wipe out the baddies with a minimum of risk. That's what tactics are all about aren't they?

 

[irdeggman]

^ That might be a way to go.

To answer the question, the party consists of the 5 characters named. However, I've seen many instances where the fighter wins initiative, charges into the room and ignores the archer rogue or the two spell casters. Or, other instances where everyone tries to go in too many directions at once and nothing gets accomplished. My hope was to make a fairly standard tactic that we could follow as a group and wipe out the baddies with a minimum of risk. That's what tactics are all about aren't they?

Well that type of situation would still not be adressed by your proposal since it involves operating independently and ignoring the other party members. IMO this is usually caused by players who don't play at team work but stil game under the 2nd ed mindset of everyone out for themselves.

 

[Demoquin]

Well if the 'leader' is actually telling the best modes of attack ... i assume you are counting that as a round or two that the enemies can have listen checks for. Whispering may cause that idea to mute as you have a door and distance to factor in. but in case of the natural 20. If you are not prepping on what to do, why do you care how the party responds to the situation? Not everyone will agree that the mage or the archer may be the best target. Some might assume that the other char might take him/them and i will take the one in the corner?

Just remember that the best laid plans if or rarely ever work out. On paper your SWAT style approach looks good. But that also depends on what is behind the door. I always assume for the worse as everything else becomes a relief.

Lets say that there is a highly armed fighter with a reach weapon and Combat Reflexes and a fairly good DEX score. There is no way you can win with that as he can take AoO's when it is flatfooted.

You could try to make some use of the Obscurring Mist spell. It will allow everyone (more or less) to get in the room with little hamperment and a 20% miss chance that works both ways.

 

[Hussar]

Well, yes, but, then again, if a DM were to have that waiting behind the door, I think I'd be calling shenanigans. How often do you actually meet a highly armed fighter with a reach weapon, high dex and combat reflexes waiting 10 feet on the other side of the door.

Also, you're missing the point. This is not discussed before each door. That's the whole point of having a standard tactic. You do the same thing each and every time because it's the best overall thing to do. There would be no listen checks because no one is talking. It's come to the door, make sure it's not trapped, and then go to the attack plan. I don't assume that my DM designs tactics specifically to counter what the party does. I assume the DM will play the opponents as they should be played, not as if they had specific knowledge that my party is walking through the door.

On the other hand, I think the following feat would solve problems quite nicely.

Bushwacker General

Prerequisites: Base attack bonus +1

During a surprise round, when you surprise an opponent, you may treat the surprise round as a full round.

Normal: During a surprise round, you may only take a standard action.

I think that would work nicely. It's not like you surprise opponents that often.

 

[Caliban]

Well, yes, but, then again, if a DM were to have that waiting behind the door, I think I'd be calling shenanigans. How often do you actually meet a highly armed fighter with a reach weapon, high dex and combat reflexes waiting 10 feet on the other side of the door.

Also, you're missing the point. This is not discussed before each door. That's the whole point of having a standard tactic. You do the same thing each and every time because it's the best overall thing to do. There would be no listen checks because no one is talking. It's come to the door, make sure it's not trapped, and then go to the attack plan. I don't assume that my DM designs tactics specifically to counter what the party does. I assume the DM will play the opponents as they should be played, not as if they had specific knowledge that my party is walking through the door.

On the other hand, I think the following feat would solve problems quite nicely.

Bushwacker General

Prerequisites: Base attack bonus +1

During a surprise round, when you surprise an opponent, you may treat the surprise round as a full round.

Normal: During a surprise round, you may only take a standard action.

I think that would work nicely. It's not like you surprise opponents that often.

I think the prerequisites for that feat are way to low for some thing that powerful.

I think should require Improved Initiative and Combat Reflexes at a minimum.

 

[RigaMortus2]

If you allow the player's to Ready an action to move in when the door is open, why would the monsters on the other side not do the same? Ready an action to attack when the door is open?