Anyone else feel indifferent about the PDF thing?

[Mournblade94]

Oh I think it is reasonable to be annoyed and post a couple of complaints. I don't find it reasonable that every time WotC does something bad (and it admittedly happens at least on a PR level) we get a dozen multipage threads that run rampant, yet every time they do something good we get a couple of threads that hardly make it past page 5 before the naysayers find something to drown them with. It is simply disproportional.

If the pages are running in the double digits it means people are passionate about it. Why does that bother you?

If WOTC does something positive it is for $e. I would not even post about it. If they do something to annoy me (Again) I will post about it.

i will not say they are evil, or stop buying their Star Wars products. They have stopped being a gaming industry friendly company. People have the right to post their dislikes.

I lost nothing. I have print copies of OD&D, AD&D, Basic D&D , and 3rd edition. The only thing I am missing is $e but I have the core. Everything else does not interest me for that edition.

If I did need 3rd edition PDF's and WOTC pulled them off, that would chap me. It would indicate WOTC is steering the market to the 4e product that many gamers (maybe not even most) find woefully lacking.

that is worthy of a lashing.

 

[Zaukrie]

I don't have the stamina to read the 20+page thread.

No where does WotC say that PDFs will NEVER, EVER be available again. Anyone who thinks that isn't beint too realistic.

WotC took nothing away from anyone, other than the opportunity to download stuff you should have downloaded already (if you paid for it already) or to buy some pdfs over the next few months.

The hatred and anger and obsession on these boards with every WotC business decision astounds me. Threads that try to actually talk about how to play the game get 1-4 pages. Threads about WotC business decisions get dozens of pages. I just don't get it. I really don't.

Clearly WotC handles this kind of stuff badly from a PR perspective. It is unlikey (understatement) that they will become the first company to stop piracy. But, look, their stuff is being stolen. They tried something. It probably won't work.

But I'm generally sympathetic to the "artist" in these situations. They made a business decision to try to protect their income stream. It was probably a bad decision.

But to spend hours, days, weeks lamenting that decision, and to stop playing a game you like, and to worry about the implications over the next few years (in terms of NEVER being able to get pdfs again), well, that's a recipe for not having a very happy life.

 

[TerraDave]

This isn't hard: if you suddenly lost a download you had paid for, you may be upset. If you were planning on buying something in pdf and now can't, you may be upset. If you see this as a pattern of screwing up all things digital that goes back for years, you may be upset.

Also, I would quible that pdfs are a new thing. Back catalog pdfs have been sold since the early days of 3E. Pdfs of newer books have also been around for years.

But Wizards will probably start selling directly (and maybe other stuff?) and this will blow over.

 

[Nymrohd]

I don't have the stamina to read the 20+page thread.

No where does WotC say that PDFs will NEVER, EVER be available again. Anyone who thinks that isn't beint too realistic.

WotC took nothing away from anyone, other than the opportunity to download stuff you should have downloaded already (if you paid for it already) or to buy some pdfs over the next few months.

The hatred and anger and obsession on these boards with every WotC business decision astounds me. Threads that try to actually talk about how to play the game get 1-4 pages. Threads about WotC business decisions get dozens of pages. I just don't get it. I really don't.

Clearly WotC handles this kind of stuff badly from a PR perspective. It is unlikey (understatement) that they will become the first company to stop piracy. But, look, their stuff is being stolen. They tried something. It probably won't work.

But I'm generally sympathetic to the "artist" in these situations. They made a business decision to try to protect their income stream. It was probably a bad decision.

But to spend hours, days, weeks lamenting that decision, and to stop playing a game you like, and to worry about the implications over the next few years (in terms of NEVER being able to get pdfs again), well, that's a recipe for not having a very happy life.

Exactly. The disturbing fact is that if we go by postcount on threads, people seem far more passionate about business decisions than about actually playing the game, sharing anecdotes about the game, discussing the games rules, or giving advice about the game.

 

[Humanaut]

I had the Adventure "Egg of the Phoenix" in my shopping cart at Piazo, pdf was going for $5-8. Looking at Amazon i can get a used hardcopy for $50 or so... so yeah, i'm ticked. Next stop to shop, ebay.

I'd prefer hardcopy, but it would be nice to get out of print stuff on the cheap rather than a questionable hardcopy.

 

[Storminator]

To me, the worst effect is what happens to ENWorld. There's what, a dozen threads about it? All of them full of angry people venting their spleen. I've gotten to the point where other people's righteous anger is completely unreadable to me.

So the worst thing for me is that the boards get shot to hell.

PS

 

[Obryn]

I'm disappointed by the mind-boggling foolishness of this action, even if it doesn't materially affect me.

You don't pull legitimate PDFs from paying customers to prevent non-paying customers from downloading them. It's not sensible. Heck, even the recording, movie, and television industries have figured this out. You can now buy no-DRM MP3s, watch TV clips online, and purchase digital movies from iTunes and Amazon.

But, like I said, I'm simply disappointed, not angry, that WotC would do something that's so clearly ... dumb. I'm not at all morally outraged, just smacking my forehead at the bone-headedness here. Then again, I'm not and have never been a PDF customer - so it's not like it's materially affecting me.

Also, I'm very, very disappointed they'd pull old, out-of-print materials from their online stores. There is quite literally no other way to make money from them, and there's absolutely zero chance that taking them away now will stop piracy. This part moves from bone-headedness into (IMHO) outright idiocy if they did it to hurt the pirates.


With that said, the hyperbole has gotten astounding. I think a large number of folks who are causing a fuss are those who already gave up on WotC. I also think most of the "I was going to spend $100 this week/month/whatever" posts are probably somewhat dishonest. Not all, to be certain, but I'd guess most.

So yeah, I said it once and I'll say it again. It's like watching your friend get back together an awful ex. There's not much you can do about it, but you know it's a bad idea and kinda cringe at the thought.

-O

 

[Hussar]

/snip

WotC declining to persue selling them any further is an unfortunate decision but not terrible. Okay they loose out on sales they might have otherwise gotten. However when they began suing people for pirating said PDF's is where you run in to some real idiocy. If you eliminate the only legitimate source for your product and there is still demand, then people will persue the illegal sources. Sue the folks sharing these files is just a bad idea. It will not eliminate their being shared. Ask the RIAA how well that tactic worked for them. Not only will it not stop them but it earns you a lot of ill will.

It is a big deal when an important company in the industry begins doing the stupid. Will it effect your local game? probably not. But honestly if it was not that big a deal to you, why did you start a thread about it?

I'm trying to stay out of this as much as I can, but I'd like to point something out about the comparisons between RIAA and WOTC's decision to sue. The RIAA lost any and all goodwill because not only were they suing pirates, but they sued EVERYONE - grandma's, kids, you name it.

Currently WOTC is suing what, six people? Presumably they have a pretty good idea who they are suing and are not talking about suing anyone and everyone who ever downloaded a pirate pdf.

There are any number of companies and groups suing pirates that aren't the RIAA. I'm not sure the comparison is really valid.

 

[Gwaihir]

Unfortunately this move by WotC does bother me.

A significant part of the enjoyment of DMing for me is skimming threads on websites such as this, hearing people discuss a specific adventure or product, imagining how/if that fits into my campaign, and often picking up a PDF of the product in question. This is now no longer an option.

 

[thedungeondelver]

As it was said earlier, EnWorld (and really, internet sites) are not a good gauge of the majority of RPG users/D&D players/et al.

I honestly believe that over 60% of those who play D&D aren't even going to be aware of the change, let alone upset about it.

I'd buy that if WotC hadn't spent so long pushing the digital initiative for 4e so hard. They seem hellbent on living or dying by it and making everyone aware of it. Suddenly not being able to use a big, big chunk of it (your books, purchaseable as PDF) is going to affect everyone. Sure they're going to be aware of it.