D&D 5E AoE spells: Do you play by RAW or RAI?

[Ancalagon]

I really can't see the difference between rules as written and rules as intended here....

it's very important - timing.

Example: Cleric casts spiritual guardian. Monster A is in area of effect. Monster B's initiative is between the cleric and Monster A. She shoots at cleric, cleric looses concentration.

RAW, monster A takes no damage, as its turn has not happened yet. But some people apply the damage instantly, meaning Monster A would have taken damage.

 

[MarkB]

it's very important - timing.

Example: Cleric casts spiritual guardian. Monster A is in area of effect. Monster B's initiative is between the cleric and Monster A. She shoots at cleric, cleric looses concentration.

RAW, monster A takes no damage, as its turn has not happened yet. But some people apply the damage instantly, meaning Monster A would have taken damage.

Yeah, but applying the damage instantly is neither the written nor intended application of the rules.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

it's very important - timing.

Example: Cleric casts spiritual guardian. Monster A is in area of effect. Monster B's initiative is between the cleric and Monster A. She shoots at cleric, cleric looses concentration.

RAW, monster A takes no damage, as its turn has not happened yet. But some people apply the damage instantly, meaning Monster A would have taken damage.

No, it is not. As explained above, you can like it or not, but RAW and RAI are tge same here.
The question is: do you like the way it works and how it is intended to work or not.

As said above, in many cases I like: apply on entry once per round no matter how you got in (actively or passively) , and at the end of your turn, so you can avoid the next instance of damage if you get out in time.
Here you only have one problem: you would receive doube damage if you volunatily enter such a space.

 

[Ancalagon]

And to answer the question, we do our best to follow RAW for these spells, although it is a bit clunky.

 

[Mistwell]

If someone were to shove you into a pool of lava would you take damage:

1. Immediately
2. Not until realizing that you are on fire in a pool of lava & escaping
3. Not until realizing you were in lava & completing the process of stabbing them when you decide to remain in the pool of lava so their friend can't get a free swipe
4. Immediately when you land in the lava & the entire time you are trying to juggle stabbing them as you are walking out of the lava pool
5. at no point because the lava was not created under you so take no initial damage upon being shoved & continue ignoring the lava while stabbing them only to be swiped at by their friend because it's a better option than remaining in the lava where you would begin taking damage

There is an entire 14 page RPG Rules book on this topic.

 

[werecorpse]

I play spirit guardians (and moonbeam etc) as doing damage on the turn of the creature in (or entering the area) which seems to be both RAI and RAW and it works well.

However I have adjusted the Web spell such that the affected creatures must make their dexterity save the moment it is cast, or when they enter the area (rather than on the start of their turn), which is consistent with the timing of the save of the entangle spell. It doesn’t make as much game sense to me that a creature can have been webbed but not suffer the effects of the web until it’s their turn. This means that if a spellcaster webs an enemy then before its initiative someone would get to attack it attack the webbed creature it is best to ready an action to attack it immediately after it rolls its save so you might get advantage.

 

[tetrasodium]

There is an entire 14 page RPG Rules book on this topic.

I've seen it & was hoping someone would mention it when I started asking

 

[Greenstone.Walker]

So a spell like moonbeam, cloudkill, or spiritual guardians doesn't do damage when cast over a creature. So you might not do any damage the first round you cast it depending what you roll for initiative.

I've never seen it played that way in any of the three campaigns I've played in or in about six months of weekly Adventurers League play with numerous DMs. So I'm curious if anybody actually plays that way?

I have always played it that way. Doing it any other way seems unfair to me.

Turn it around - imagine if a GM did it to your character.

GM: The EHP casts a moonbeam spell. Fighter, you take 16 points of damage. Fighter, it's your turn next. You are starting your turn in the area of effect, so you take another 16 points of damage.

I also use the general rule that such spells can only affect you a maximum of once per turn, to stop the "dragging the enemy through spike growth many times" shenanigans.

 

[Nefermandias]

How is this even up to debate really? I blame this on 5e being hellbent in it's efforts to use only "natural language"
This would never be a problem back in 4e.

 

[Lanefan]

Involuntary entry counts as entry. It's cheesy but the wording on several spells lets different N/PCs drag a target N/PC in and out of a damaging zone, doing damage on each moving character's turn.

That sounds like exactly the sort of thing houserules exist to fix.