Are the Summon Monster Tables set in stone?

[Otterscrubber]

Are you only allowed to choose from monsters in the tables presented in the PHB or has there ever been a printed set of guidelines to help you choose other options? Frankly I don't get some of the choices that are currently there, some seem way to weak. I'd like to think of some other ones but it's hard to come up with appropriate ones based on what's there.

 

[andargor]

Are you only allowed to choose from monsters in the tables presented in the PHB or has there ever been a printed set of guidelines to help you choose other options? Frankly I don't get some of the choices that are currently there, some seem way to weak. I'd like to think of some other ones but it's hard to come up with appropriate ones based on what's there.

Last I saw, they were written on paper.

I have not seen any guidelines to this effect, but I guess you could house rule approved creatures with CR = Summon Monster level.

EDIT: Looking at the list, perhaps CR-1 or CR-2 = Summon Monster level. Summon Monster IX has CR 10-11 creatures.

Andargor

 

[jgsugden]

Using CR is not a good tool. CR measures the challenge the creature provides as a foe, but does not take into account the benefit the creature might provide as an ally nor the reduced abilities resulting from summoning (no teleportation, no summoning, etc ...). As a gross example: A creature that can cast heal at will, but has no attacks, would probably have a fairly low CR, but would be something way too powerful to be granted by any SM spell.

Using ECL is another option, but it fails to take into account the limited duration alliance and reduced abilities of the summoned creature. ECL is based upon the value a creature will provide as a long term ally. If the creature is only present in the short term, those long term benefits may be valued inappropriately. As an example, if the creature can cast a spell with a long duration, that duration ends when the summon spell ends, so the value of that ability is overemphasized.

Both, however, provide a good guideline. If the ECL of the monster is greater than the level of the lowest level PC that could cast the spell, be cautious of adding it to a summon monster list. If the CR exceeds the CRs of other monsters on the list, be cautious of adding it to the list as well.

 

[Silveras]

Are you only allowed to choose from monsters in the tables presented in the PHB or has there ever been a printed set of guidelines to help you choose other options? Frankly I don't get some of the choices that are currently there, some seem way to weak. I'd like to think of some other ones but it's hard to come up with appropriate ones based on what's there.

A year or so ago, there was an article in Dragon magazine outlining how to expand the Summon Monster and Summon Nature's Ally lists. It was, I think, mostly CR-based.

Unearthed Arcana has variant summoning lists, and talks about using customized lists to add flavor.

 

[Scion]

I've always liked the mix-matching of templates for extra choices myself. While this doesnt add extra creatures per se it does add extra choices which can be nice.

I have done it such that whatever template is available for the creature can be exchanged for one of equivalent cost. So far I have only done this for celestial, fiendish, axiomatic, and the other alignment one for even costs. I also allow using a creature from a lower list with a template of one higher cost, so at appropriate levels you could turn in a summon monster 6 say for a creature from the summon monster 5 list with a template like halfdragon or something.

I have had no real problems yet, maybe at some point it will be one. But so far it is just nice to have a lot of extra options and choices

 

[Olive]

I allow clerics to apply templates as per their gods alignment plus any elemental templates the god is related too (such as Bahamut to air), as well as any other appropriate greatures (a cleric of a NG god can summon any type of good outsider).

I allow wizards to add to their list via spellcraft checks, including multiple types of template.

Note that this is all house rules. I do use the dragon #302 system to assign the level, but I've found it can be a little low. I also only allow the spells to summon outsiders, elementals and templated animals, not every creature in the book with a template splashed on like green slime does.

More recent WotC books have put the SM spell level for creatures in their recent books (FF, BoED), and hopefully this will continue!

 

[VirgilCaine]

So far I have only done this for celestial, fiendish, axiomatic, and the other alignment one for even costs.

Anarchic. That was the easy one, axiomatic is hard.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

Adding flexibility does add power to the spell. That's something to keep in mind. As it is, a cleric's options are often more limited than a wizard's, since a good or evil cleric can't summon creatures of the opposite alignment. Simply allowing them to replace "celestial bison" with "fiendish bison" is going to give a bit more power to evil clerics - and replacing "fiendish crocodile" with "celestial crocodile" will give slightly more power to the good clerics. It's about having the right resource for the challenge.
Also, anarchic monsters can only be summoned by CN punk characters. Bards with no actual ranks in Perform can summon monsters that are twice as anarchic.

 

[trentonjoe]

I use the UA variant rule of adding one monster per list per level. My conjurerers 3rd level list is this:

Summon Monster

1st Level
Celestial dog LG
Celestial giant fire beetle NG
Celestial monstrous scorpion, Small NG
2nd Level
Celestial monstrous centipede, Large NG


I am going to apply the cold or anarchic template to my next critter.

 

[Scion]

Apply the halfogre template!

oop.. dont mind me

Can you add any template with the ua version? I will check with someone who has it tomorrow if no one will tell me here

Oh, and from the people I know who have made characters around summoning they are very versitile, but rarely powerful. Adding a little bit more flavor that just-so-happens to give some power probably isnt terribly over the top. Opinions may differ though.