Are there official rules for "lack of sleep"?

[Sonofapreacherman]

One can extrapolate out some guidelines for penalties for failing to rest out of some of the existing rules but the RAW do not provide any such penalties.

Which very conclusively answers my initial question. There are no "official rules" rules for ordinary lack of sleep in 3rd edition.

I seem to recall a 2nd edition rule that stated characters needed at least 4 hours of sleep per night or they would suffer a cumulative -1 modifier on certain d20 rolls. This resulted in two sets of 4 hour guard duties at night among the party when camping in a wilderness or dungeon setting. I certainly don't think characters who miss one night of sleep are so fatigued that running is going to be impossible the next day.

Maybe we can borrow from the 3.5 edition forced march mechanic and say that if a character has not slept after 2 days (for 8 hours), a Constitution check (DC 10 + 2 per extra day) is required. Failure results in the character becoming fatigued. The Constitution check continues to increase for each additional day, with a second failure result leaving the character exhausted, and a third failure result leaving the character unconscious. Characters can otherwise sustain themselves on a minimum of 4 hours of sleep, so long as that much sleep is managed each night.

How does that sound?

 

[Jhulae]

Well, the actual need for sleep can be inferred by this sentence from 'Ring of Sustinance': "The ring also refreshes the body and mind, so that its wearer needs only sleep 2 hours per day to gain the benefit of 8 hours of sleep."

Therefore, it does seem the rules imply that characters need 8 hours of sleep or, as is implied elsewhere, they are fatigued.

YMMV.

 

[Nik_the_Pig]

Well I agree with others that the RAW are a little lacking in their coverage of this issue.

I'd be careful letting characters get away with little sleep but putting a figure on what's enough is hard (do elves need sleep in your campaign?).

I'm a police officer now, am youngish, quite fit, eat well etc etc and particularly on night shift, even after 6-8hour sleep during the day am still rats**t by 3am in the morning. It takes me 3-4 days before I'm able to function fully on a changed sleeping paten.

I was in the military before this and could operate well on 2-3hours interrupted sleep as long as I grabbed what rest I could when I could (5min sleep here and there, putting the brain on auto pilot when cleaning my weapons, etc). I could sleep on (almost) anything (put my neck out sleeping on some rocks once) but sleeping in kevlar is tough.

Having said all this my dad's almost 70, has a bit of a gut on him, drinks a goodly amount, regularly gets less than 2 hours sleep and still has the energy to go on 7 day motorcycle safaris.

It takes all types.

 

[Christian]

Maybe we can borrow from the forced march mechanic and say that if a character has not slept after 2 days (for 8 hours), a Constitution check (DC 10 + 2 per extra day) is required. Failure results in the character becoming fatigued. The Constitution check continues to increase for each additional day, with a second failure result leaving the character exhausted, and a third failure result leaving the character unconscious. Characters can otherwise sustain themselves on a minimum of 4 hours of sleep, so song as that much sleep is managed each night.

How does that sound?

It sounds like characters who don't want to take off their heavy armor can evade the penalties for 'sleeping in heavy armor' by not sleeping at all. At least on alternate nights ... The printed rules are certainly lacking, but if you're wanting to add some, the penalties for not getting any sleep need to be at least as bad as the ones for getting poor sleep by trying to use your plate armor as pajamas.

 

[Sonofapreacherman]

Well, the actual need for sleep can be inferred by this sentence from 'Ring of Sustinance': "The ring also refreshes the body and mind, so that its wearer needs only sleep 2 hours per day to gain the benefit of 8 hours of sleep."

Therefore, it does seem the rules imply that characters need 8 hours of sleep or, as is implied elsewhere, they are fatigued.

Actually, I think all that implies is what we have been talking about so far. The ring of sustenance makes that stipulation for the purpose of healing, preparing arcane spells, and the like, but there are still no rules for simply not sleeping. There are lots of side effects (not being able to heal, not being able to prepare arcane spells) but no official penalties for continuously remaining awake.

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It sounds like characters who don't want to take off their heavy armor can evade the penalties for 'sleeping in heavy armor' by not sleeping at all. At least on alternate nights ...

For one night, yes. But it could just as easily by 1 day (instead of 2) before making a Constitution check. I suggested 2 days at first to gage what people thought. It can be scaled back to 1 depending on what people feel is more realistic.

The printed rules are certainly lacking, but if you're wanting to add some, the penalties for not getting any sleep need to be at least as bad as the ones for getting poor sleep by trying to use your plate armor as pajamas.

Well, as per my proposed rule, it would be on failed Constitution check.

 

[DarkMaster]

or some very few as little as 3 hours a night (my uncle Bob).

Are you sure uncle Bob is not an elf

 

[Otterscrubber]

As far as I can tell there are no specific rules on sleep. There may be some allusions to it if you look hard enough, but nothing specific as to how much and how often.

I think a good rule would be to treat every hour less than 8 that you sleep as a forced march of equal hours. Make the con check to see if you are fatigued and take it from there.

Although I like in the description of fatigue that it says anything you do that would fatigue you would make you exhausted. So according to that only sleeping in armor and a forced march can make you exhausted since I have not seen anything else that would cause fatigue, other than some necro spells. Would have been interesting if they made a list of things that fatigue you.

 

[Darklone]

Conan d20 has rules about lack of sleep (and appropriate feats).

 

[PaulGreystoke]

Although I like in the description of fatigue that it says anything you do that would fatigue you would make you exhausted. So according to that only sleeping in armor and a forced march can make you exhausted since I have not seen anything else that would cause fatigue, other than some necro spells. Would have been interesting if they made a list of things that fatigue you.

There are some other situations that induce fatigue. Off the top of my head I can think of being at high altitudes (hourly Fort saves to avoid) & going without sufficient food or water. I expect that there are many more.

Anyway, I think that it can be inferred from the rules that characters need to rest periodically or else incur the effects of fatigue. But the rules are silent as to what constitutes sufficient rest. Clearly the wizard spell preparation requirements would seem to be the maximum requirement. Non-wizards would likely need less to operate unimpaired. But in the absence of a hard & fast rule, DMs must use their own judgement as to how much (& what kind of) rest is sufficient on a normal basis. Of course, I'll have my questions about the judgement of any DM who rules that a character does not need to rest except to prepare spells or to regain hit points. YMMV.

 

[Christian]

The printed rules are certainly lacking, but if you're wanting to add some, the penalties for not getting any sleep need to be at least as bad as the ones for getting poor sleep by trying to use your plate armor as pajamas.

Well, as per my proposed rule, it would be on failed Constitution check.

'Fatigued on a failed Constitution check' is not 'as least as bad as' 'fatigued.' Again, why should simply staying awake cause you to get to roll to avoid the negative effect you would get from an uncomfortable sleep? This looks backwards-if anything, you should get a roll if you try to sleep and none if you try to stay awake.