Are three enough?

[RangerRick]

Both are cool with me, I can see some people saying 6 is more complex than 3 but not if you set it up one for one with abilities I mean in your system the saving throw basically becomes an ability check. Maybe it's a little harder to remember which condition maps to which ability but I don't think it would be by much.

 

[RangerRick]

When you make an ability check the score you're trying to hit is always the same (aside from a modifier or two). It's your ability score itself. When you make a saving throw the score you're trying to hit is set by... what? The level of the opponent doing the casting; the strength of the poison; the degree of complication of the illusion; or whatever other scale is desired can be used to set the DC for that saving throw.

That's a good point about the DC but you could still use ability checks and give different poisons, spell levels, etc. different modifiers on the check.

 

[billd91]

I generally like the 3 saves in 3e/PF, though I can see an argument for 1 more. I'd be tempted to focus the defense Will saves are good for to enchantment or other mind-affecting types of things and separate out a general "Everything Else" save that would apply to magic or other attacks that don't fit the physical resistance, dodge, strong will defensive paradigm. I'd consider having it modified, if at all, by Charisma.

 

[was]

the 3 are enough for me

 

[Wiseblood]

[MENTION=86876]Iron Wolf[/MENTION]

Charisma for a number of reasons.
*Paladins get save bonuses because of charisma...have you ever asked why?
*Charisma needs love too.
*The hit has already been sustained your character needs to get through the debilitating paralysis. It is not caused by venom or by spinal injury. I would attribute it to supernatural forces. Charisma makes as much sense as fortitude or willpower in my opinion.


I should have been clearer. Perhaps this is more succinct.


"Resistance was composed of an active opposition through physical action or willpower to prevent an effect.


The strength check listed was the one of the few that I felt strengthened my side. For instance the reflex save is something you have already failed if you are making strength checks. You are expending an action to break an effect. In 3e action economy is one of the most critical considerations. I do not recall the DC for such a strength check but it is safe to say it is high. It being an ongoing area effect, and you are in the area, does it make as much sense that you can dodge it?



It's true these things can be resolved by rules as written. I have said before, they've worked so far. This is a matter of taste. I would prefer for mechanics with more continuity. Hopefully that makes sense.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

Endurance was for situations where you had already been struck and were trying to prevent further harm.

Resistance was composed of an active opposition through action or willpower to prevent an effect.

Okay, I can see this working. I'm not clear on what inconsistencies you're trying to fix with these extra saves, but I don't see them imploding the game.

 

[IronWolf]

It's true these things can be resolved by rules as written. I have said before, they've worked so far. This is a matter of taste. I would prefer for mechanics with more continuity. Hopefully that makes sense.

Oh I certainly get the matter of taste. I am not here to say someone is playing the game wrong or anything like that. People should do what works well for their game and have fun with it!

My suspicion though is a more complex saving throw system while trying to capture every scenario by something 100% logically accurate is going to lead towards slow downs, more "discussions" over which save should fit in what category and essentially further add to the rules something that can be handled pretty quickly and with little argument now.

 

[MoxieFu]

Good idea but Castles & Crusades beat you to it. It gets rid of the whole concept of a "dump stat". All abilities become important when saves are attached to them.

Oh and I hate the idea of giving them different names like Fortitude and Endurance.

 

[BryonD]

Three is good.

I'm very open to other systems.
Three isn't the end-all.
But it works fine.

 

[Wiseblood]

Oh I certainly get the matter of taste. I am not here to say someone is playing the game wrong or anything like that. People should do what works well for their game and have fun with it!

My suspicion though is a more complex saving throw system while trying to capture every scenario by something 100% logically accurate is going to lead towards slow downs, more "discussions" over which save should fit in what category and essentially further add to the rules something that can be handled pretty quickly and with little argument now.

That suspicion is a likely outcome. Perhaps it would be Unearthed Arcana worthy or simply a sidebar add-on.


I will have to take a look at the C&C rules and see what they're about.