Are you doing your part to destroy the industry?

Griffonsec

First Post
So, all the "sky is falling" threads have gotten me thinking about the ups and downs in the RPG industry. Like all businesses it seems to go through cycles, especially withing each individule company.

Now, I started playing in '82, and while there are those who have played longer, I think there are very few who have played as consistantly. I take a six week break whenever I have a new baby (number three is due a week from tomorrow), but that's about the longest time I have ever gone between games.

I actually even use my free time during that six weeks to plan out new campaigns (this time it will be Spycraft).

So, I've seen a few of those ups and downs on the way.

OMG, these fanatics that think we're devil worshipers are going to destroy the game!
OMG, that Magic game is going to destroy the game!
OMG, Everquest is going to destroy the game!
OMG, Hasboro is going to destroy the game!

You get the point.

But seriously, some people do feel like the game is collapsing, and I think for a lot of us that is directly tied to our own experiences. We buy less, so the game must be falling down without our support.

So, what are you doing that is destroying the game? What is it that is driving you awy?

I myself have bought a lot less this year and last than usual. It's not a matter of not having money really, I own my own business and do well for myself, but I just feel like the games aren't worth it so much any more.

For me, a hobby doesn't cost $50 a book. Especially as a DM and collector, I buy a half dozen or so books a month, and at these prices it's really eating into my "fun budget." At some point it becomes a matter of diminishing returns. How much do I have to use a book to feel like I got my money's worth.

It's not even price so much as value. I spent $40 on the new Spycraft book, in fact, I bought 2. I spent $50 on Stargate, another $50 on Game of Thrones, the list goes on... Then I see books like Grim Tales, which I would like, but $35 for a 200 page book seems idiotic. The Spycraft book was $5 more and it was 2 and a half times larger, on high quality paper, and in full color. Same thing with Game of thrones. It was a bit more, but I don't mind paying a bit extra when you have licensing fees to deal with.

But, you see books like those of WOTC and other companies who seem to just be doing all they can to force the price up, and I just can't stomache buying the books. The only thing that has had a similar rate of inflation to RPGs of the last five years or so is gas, and people around the world are outraged by that. And just like gas, it's not that I can't aford the increase, but that doesn't mean I'll pay it when I don't have to.

I guess the other thing, and probably the worse one for me, is second (or higher) editions. I stopped playing Vampire when it started to feel like I was buying the same books over and over again every year or two. I skipped the second edition of L5R, which I love, because I didn't think it was worth buying all the books again. I stopped buying d20 Starwars when my rulebook was outdated months after it came out. Likewise with games like Midnight, Mutants and Masterminds, and all of these other "new edition" books which are basically reprints with a few pages of new materials.

If it was just the big rulebooks it wouldn't be so bad, but with each new edition comes the obligatory worldbooks, clan books, and class guides. As a GM you feel obligated to keep up with the SOTA, so if I can't, I just drop the game from my "to buy" list. Better to cut my losses now. Such blatant money grabs are just beyond my ability to tolerate.

Sure, I've taken the bait if I felt it was absolutely necesary. I have DnD 3.5, and even though I feel that it is inferior to 3.0 in a lot of ways we still play it. I also have Spycraft 2.0 because I felt it was just too damn good not to own. The changes and updates were enough, for me, to make it worth my while.

Still, that's not to say that I really think the game is about to die, I just wanted to say that I'm doing my part, and why. When 3.0 came out I bout everything. I have an entire bookshelf stack up with games I'll never play from companies many people have never heard of, but my 3.5 bookshelf shares space with a lot of other games, and it probably always will. I now buy Shadowrun, Spycraft, and Fireborn (well, if they ever realease anything else) almost exclusively. Sure, I'll pick up the occassional product that looks good, but those are the things that factor into my decision. How much is the cost to page count/usefulness, and how frequently are they releasing new editions.

So, finally, my question to you is, are you doing your part to destroy the industry, and why?
 

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So, you buy the books you think are worth the price and you do not buy the books you don't think are worth the price. Many people probably do that.

Sounds like the darwinian concept of evolution to me, towards better quality.

I think you support the industry in giving them your feedback and opinion (by choosing what you buy) and allowing them to steer their productions towards the right direction!

Good job, game on! :)

Bye
Thanee
 

I use to spend about $1500 a year on gaming stuff, but lost my job about 30 months ago, and have spent about $100 total in that time. So i am doing my part to destroy the industry, though not by choice.
 

I do my part by being an unemployed English grad-student with 50k in debt.

Yay, debt.

I don't buy many RPG books. I bought WotC's core 3 for 3.0, and I bought them again for 3.5 when that came out and I found them with a super-deal from an online retailer and got all of them for 40 bucks. Those are the last D&D products I bought.

When I buy, I buy what I LIKE. I picked up Grim Tales after paging through it, and didn't consider it any more expensive than anything else.

I'm a tinkerer, so I tend to get the core book(s) to something and run my own games. The last time I bought world-books was 2nd ed (when I had free cash), and I had alot of the boxed sets for D&D.

So I'm not supporting the industry all that much. Maybe in three or four years when I have a decent job and have paid off all of my school loans.

--fje
 

D&D for Dummies?

Well, whats the deal with the roleplaying for dummies books?.. have you seen them? Is this a Shot at gaining new gamers because they need money, or because they have the extra money the try and branch out...


personally, its rubbish. We already bought a core rule book. Or two. Or three. Or....

anyways, I don't know what I'm talking about... but maybe an affect of slacking business?

maybe on an individual basis...
 
Last edited:

RangerWickett said:
I write books. I know. I'm terrible.

Lol, you're one of the good ones. I'm a PDF fiend, it's probably the best thing for the future of the industry really.

Honestly, I think that all of those calls for refunds and such when 3.5 replaced 3.0 might actually have a place in a PDF driven industry. Those who want to entice their readers into picking up new edditions could easily offer upgrade rates and such. Not to meantion, the lower prices that many companies offer on PDFs help to keep the costs at hobby level.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to dig at authors. Very few of them make the money decisions anyway. I'm not even digging at the industry. Perhaps my tongue was a bit too far in my cheek.

What I'm trying to say is that I believe that many people who feel like the industry is going to die feel that way because they see their interest, and purchases, slackening. I was hoping to spark discourse on why that might be, not attack people who work hard to produce games they love.
 

I am participating in discussing OGC Wikis that will result in the cesseion of all OGC production and the downfall of the entire gaming community! Muhahahahah!

And I'm neglecting my PbP thread, badly. :(
 

I firmly believe PDFs have cut into WOTCs (and others) hardbound book sales. DMs and players no longer need to shell out $30-50 for a hardbound book to get the 10 pages of material they need, they can go online and cherry-pick exactly what they need from places like RPGNow, EN World Store, Drive Thru RPG, etc. If I want a few new spells there are tons of PDF available from places like Ronin Arts, etc. to get it. If I want a new prestiege class, I can buy just that one thing and nothing else. Online PDFs have revolutionized how gamers acquire their gaming needs. There is such a massive quantity of subjects available in PDF that I dare say just about anything you could ever want is out there somewhere or soon will be. Several of my players get almost everything they game with as PDFs and just bring a laptop and a PHB to the game table.
 

But, you see books like those of WOTC and other companies who seem to just be doing all they can to force the price up, and I just can't stomache buying the books. The only thing that has had a similar rate of inflation to RPGs of the last five years or so is gas, and people around the world are outraged by that. And just like gas, it's not that I can't aford the increase, but that doesn't mean I'll pay it when I don't have to.

And yet, over the course of the entire existence of D&D, the price of RPG books has increased less than the overall rate of inflation. If they'd followed inflation from the late 70s to now, they'd cost a lot more than they do.

That doesn't mean you have to buy them if they cost more than you're willing to spend. But it does mean that suggestions that WotC or anyone else is "trying to force the prices up" are somewhat uninformed.
 

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