At what distance do you start making Listen checks?

[tylermalan]

The PHB says that a PC gets -1 to his Listen check for every 10 ft. of distance between himself and whatever he is listening to, but it doesn't say how far out the target has to be before you can start making listen checks to determine if you hear it or not.

I guess it would make sense for the PCs to make checks as soon as they have a CHANCE to succeed, which would be rolling a natural 20. By this I mean that if a PC has a Listen modifier of +9, and he rolls a 20 for a total of 29, then he could start making listen checks when the target is close enough to drop the DC down to 29. But if you do that, how often do you have him make listen checks afterwards, since the chance of hearing his target is so low? Once a round?

Does anyone have an official ruling on this, or a good house rule?

 

[Infiniti2000]

I guess it would make sense for the PCs to make checks as soon as they have a CHANCE to succeed, which would be rolling a natural 20.

First, rolling a natural 20 is not automatic success.

By this I mean that if a PC has a Listen modifier of +9, and he rolls a 20 for a total of 29, then he could start making listen checks when the target is close enough to drop the DC down to 29. But if you do that, how often do you have him make listen checks afterwards, since the chance of hearing his target is so low? Once a round?

As often as the target makes move silently checks or as often as the PC purposefully makes a move action to Listen. He makes all reactive checks without using an action, so how often is not up to him.

Does anyone have an official ruling on this, or a good house rule?

Those are the rules on it, but I'm guessing what you're really after is determining encounter distance? That's a different subject.

 

[TheGogmagog]

First average chance of sucess sounds good (as a house rule), with all parties taking 10 on thier checks. ie, heavily armored person in group #1 with a net -4 move silently, the group #2 with a person with +9 listen. If they both roll 10, it's 6 vs 19, so at 130' is your first listen check. I would use that for a starter, then check again when distances are halved.

If the group #1 has a max spot of +5 and group 2 also has a min move silently of -4, then they are just at a disadvantage on that first check.

You can't have checks every round because you arn't in combat, you don't have rounds.

If you used your first chance of sucess, -3 vs 29 your first check is 320', with little chance of sucess. Personally, I assume that the players and opponents are taking 10 on all checks unless they ask to make one. That way players don't miss an open door because he didn't ask. Then only roll when it should be more random, like an encounter distance.

As far as actual rule there are encounter distances in the DMG, I'm pretty sure they are only considering spot distances though. (line of sight indoors if I recall).

 

[TheGogmagog]

First, rolling a natural 20 is not automatic success.

I almost said that then I made sure I read ALL of what he said. He used the result of a rolled 20, and didn't say anything about automatic sucess.

 

[TheGogmagog]

First average chance of sucess sounds good (as a house rule), with all parties taking 10 on thier checks. ie, heavily armored person in group #1 with a net -4 move silently, the group #2 with a person with +9 listen. If they both roll 10, it's 6 vs 19, so at 130' is your first listen check.

Note that if one party is explicitly not trying to move silently, ie talking or singing the dc to hear them is 0 (armor check wouldn't modify that).

 

[Infiniti2000]

I almost said that then I made sure I read ALL of what he said. He used the result of a rolled 20, and didn't say anything about automatic sucess.

Well, the concept of "natural" when rolling is usually an attempt to denote automatic success. Maybe it was unintentional, but IME it is a misunderstanding.

 

[Dracorat]

Id say you roll as soon there is a chance of success.

 

[Stalker0]

I would go with what you said, start at a distance they have a chance to succeed. Then they hear it once they get close enough.

For example, guy has MS of 10.

Player gets a listen check of 20. He has a -1 per 10 feet, so at 100 feet he has a 10. He would hear the guy at 100 feet. I wouldn't keep making checks, just use the first one.

 

[Tinker]

Well, the concept of "natural" when rolling is usually an attempt to denote automatic success.

I'd say the concept of "natural 20" is that you roll 20 on the die, as opposed to achieving a result of 20 by die roll plus modifiers.

It was used this sense in earlier editions of the game where a natural 20 had special results other than an automatic success (it hit an AC four better than an adjusted 20, but one less than an adjusted 21 IIRC).

It seems to me that tylermalan is using it in this sense - a die roll of 20 as distinct from an adjusted result of 20.


I play that you don't have to be in combat to use rounds. The DM can use rounds in any tactical situation where they would be useful. A situation where one party is approaching another and the DM wants to know how many chances there are for them to hear each other's noise would be an ideal time to use rounds.

I would agree that if you are rolling checks you start rolling as soon as there is a chance for success on whatever check you are using. If you are taking 10 then you just say that the characters hear the noise when it is close enough to be audible on a take 10.

 

[tylermalan]

I wasn't referring to a natural 20 being automatic success, but I see how it could be misinterpreted.

My problem is that the whole taking 10 thing sort of removes the chance from it all... if they are always assumed to be taking 10, then certain MS checks they will ALWAYS hear, and others they will never hear. On that note, I also don't necessarily want my characters to be contstantly willfully making listen checks, just in case.