Attack types with different ranges in full attack

[Liminal Syzygy]

Situation:

1) A medium sized creature is wielding a glaive or other weapon with 10' reach.

2) The creature also has a natural weapon (say a bite) secondary attack which has 5' reach.

If the creature takes the full attack action, does it have to take it's secondary natural attack after or before the attacks with the reach weapon?

In other words, if it starts 10' from it's target can it do a full attack with it's reach weapon, then take a 5' step during the full attack, then follow up with it's bite?

And visa-versa if it starts at 5' and initiates a full attack can it bite first in this case, then take a 5' step back during the full attack action and follow up with the reach weapon attacks?

 

[AuraSeer]

You may take the 5' step at any point in your attack. You may also take your attacks in any order you like. So, both of your examples do work.

It's even possible to take your first glaive attack at 10' away, step in and bite to drop the opponent, then use your second glaive attack on the guy behind him.

 

[Hypersmurf]

You may take the 5' step at any point in your attack. You may also take your attacks in any order you like. So, both of your examples do work.

Then again, of course, there's always that unusual line in the description of Full Attack: "If you get multiple attacks because your base attack bonus is high enough, you must make the attacks in order from highest bonus to lowest."

Has anyone ever determined exactly what it means?

-Hyp.

 

[Deset Gled]

Then again, of course, there's always that unusual line in the description of Full Attack: "If you get multiple attacks because your base attack bonus is high enough, you must make the attacks in order from highest bonus to lowest."

Has anyone ever determined exactly what it means?

-Hyp.

I was under the impression that it means you must make your attacks in decending BAB order: +20 followed by +15 followed by +10 followed by +5. You cannot take attacks in ascending order, or randomly. I imagine that it could be argued that attacks must be made in descending order of all bonuses, but that seems like it would be pretty annoying to keep track of.

Either way, there are few situations where changing the order would make a large difference in play, but attacking in order of descending BAB keeps things the simplest.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I was under the impression that it means you must make your attacks in decending BAB order: +20 followed by +15 followed by +10 followed by +5. You cannot take attacks in ascending order, or randomly. I imagine that it could be argued that attacks must be made in descending order of all bonuses, but that seems like it would be pretty annoying to keep track of.

Either way, there are few situations where changing the order would make a large difference in play, but attacking in order of descending BAB keeps things the simplest.

Right.

But aren't all secondary natural attacks made at your highest BAB (with a -5 penalty, or -2 with Multi-Attack)?

So if I have a glaive and a bite attack, and a BAB of +16, and no other modifiers, are my attacks not:

A. Glaive +16 (BAB +16)
B. Glaive +11 (BAB +11)
C. Glaive +6 (BAB +6)
D. Glaive +1 (BAB +1)
and
Sec. Bite +11 (BAB +16, -5 penalty for secondary attack)?

Doesn't that mean that the Bite can be taken before or after A (since they use the same BAB to determine their total bonus), but must be taken before B, C, or D (since the Bite's BAB component is higher than all of those attacks, and attacks must be taken in order from highest bonus to lowest)?

-Hyp.

 

[Black Knight Irios]

I would say, you take first your iterative attacks then your bite.
Using the example of Hyp:
Glaive +16/+11/+6/+1 and bite +11 simply because the iterative attacks are your primary attacks and the bite is secondary, but I wouldn't mind using bite first and then the iteratives. But to keep things simple I wouldn't allow to do 2 iteratives then bite and do the remaining iteratives, don't make things unecessarilly complicated.

 

[Majere]

You can attack, move and attack ?
Could someone give me a page number on that as I was pretty sure you couldnt do that. If you have a page for me to show my DM Id be much endebted.

Majere

 

[Tatsukun]

You can attack, take a 5' step and finish your full attack. What you are doing is just taking your 5' step in the middle of your full attack.

Of course, you can't move more than the 5' step (as that would be another action, namely a move action). A 5' step can be taken before, after, or in the middle of any other action.

As for order of attacks, I have always read it as that you have to make your attacks in descending attack bonus order for each weapon. For example let's say you have ...

(L1)Longsword +12
(L2) Longsword +7
(D1) Offhand Dagger +4

You can mix it up any way you want, but L1 must be before L2.

-Tatsu

 

[Black Knight Irios]

(L1)Longsword +12
(L2) Longsword +7
(D1) Offhand Dagger +4

You can mix it up any way you want, but L1 must be before L2.

Sure L1 must always be made before you can attempt L2, and I have no problem with:
l1,l2,d1
d1,l1,l2
but that would make it a bit difficult especially if it would involve even more attacks:
l1,d1,l2!!!

 

[Majere]

You can attack, take a 5' step and finish your full attack. What you are doing is just taking your 5' step in the middle of your full attack.

Of course, you can't move more than the 5' step (as that would be another action, namely a move action). A 5' step can be taken before, after, or in the middle of any other action.

As for order of attacks, I have always read it as that you have to make your attacks in descending attack bonus order for each weapon. For example let's say you have ...

(L1)Longsword +12
(L2) Longsword +7
(D1) Offhand Dagger +4

You can mix it up any way you want, but L1 must be before L2.

-Tatsu

Yes but where does it say this, we have been playing that you cant move in the middle of an attack, so if you could give me a page Id be most grateful