D&D 5E Attacking on an ally's space before finishing your move?

[tommybahama]

Hi guys,

This came up during a session last night. With every DM I've played with in 5E you can move into an ally's space and attack from that space so long as you don't end your turn in that space. I'm wondering how all you Enworlders manage it at your table?

One player at our table pointed out this tweet from Jeremy Crawford:

Personally, I think he's off his rocker, never done any martial arts or watched a movie with medieval or fantasy combat. But I'm interested in how you guys run it at your table. For quick reference, here is the relevant section from page 191:

From the first highlight it appears Crawford is right. But the second highlight directs you to Page 192 which includes this:

Related thread from a few years back: Enworld: Attacking on an ally's space

 

[el-remmen]

I'd allow it but at disadvantage (I use advantage/disadvantage as a "conditional" modifier all the time) out of the possibility of bumping into or being too cautious to avoid your too close ally. Heck, I'd even bend the rules and let two people occupy the same square with disadvantage on both of them and would allow two small creatures to occupy the same square with NO penalty.

Rulings not rules!

 

[iserith]

Personally, I don't care what Crawford says unless I can use it to win an argument on internet forums. But the way we play it at my table - on the grid - is that you cannot stop in an occupied square (with exceptions like swarms) and make an attack, then continue on. The rules you cite seem to me to be more geared towards theater of the mind play where such considerations are probably not as much of a concern as when playing en tableau vivant.

 

[billd91]

I don't allow attacking from an ally's square. It leads to all sorts of potential abuse.

Ultimately, if you can attack from someone else's space, in effect doing anything except end your turn, what exactly is the point of having a space in the first place? PCs being in and doing things from their own space is a fundamental assumption of the grid-based rules.

 

[Benjamin Olson]

I don't quite see how anything in the cited PHB texts has anything to do with whether you can occupy someone else's space.

I don't think I've ever run or been at a table where attacking from someone else's space (unless you are riding them) was allowed. I can't be sure that I or one of my DMs didn't allow it when someone was finding themselves wasting turns in a hallway battle, but generally I wouldn't allow it or expect it to be allowed. And this is mostly to the benefit of players, as it keeps the whole zombie horde from being able to effectively make their attacks more often than it keeps a player from doing something productive with their turn. Allowing it also seems like it would reduce the importance of terrain to combat, by making choke points and other confined spaces less consequential, which isn't inherently bad but seems to me like it would just make combat strategy less interesting.

 

[Oofta]

Anything the PCs can do, the enemy can do. Can you imagine a PC trying to hold a choke point while every single opponent jumps into the same square to attack them?

It's too open to abuse to allow this and I've never seen anyone do it. In theory you could attack with disadvantage I suppose but I still seeing it changing combat dynamics and not in an enjoyable way.

 

[Stormonu]

I let allies move through a characters space and we've had instances of half-orcs and halflings sharing spaces, but normally I don't allow characters to stop in an allies space, make an attack and move on - they have to do an attack from an open space.

 

[bedir than]

I would insist that my character isn't "stopped" until their turn is done. There's absolutely no reason to think that an experienced adventurer needs to pause as they are walking in order to swing a sword.

 

[el-remmen]

I don't quite see how anything in the cited PHB texts has anything to do with whether you can occupy someone else's space.

I don't think I've ever run or been at a table where attacking from someone else's space (unless you are riding them) was allowed. I can't be sure that I or one of my DMs didn't allow it when someone was finding themselves wasting turns in a hallway battle, but generally I wouldn't allow it or expect it to be allowed. And this is mostly to the benefit of players, as it keeps the whole zombie horde from being able to effectively make their attacks more often than it keeps a player from doing something productive with their turn. Allowing it also seems like it would reduce the importance of terrain to combat, by making choke points and other confined spaces less consequential, which isn't inherently bad but seems to me like it would just make combat strategy less interesting.

Anything the PCs can do, the enemy can do. Can you imagine a PC trying to hold a choke point while every single opponent jumps into the same square to attack them?

It's too open to abuse to allow this and I've never seen anyone do it. In theory you could attack with disadvantage I suppose but I still seeing it changing combat dynamics and not in an enjoyable way.

As someone who has run games using a grid since 2E days with many of the rules that would evolve through the editions that followed, applying a penalty to two medium creatures (or three small) in the same square for their attacks and potential defense (like Dexterity/Reflex saves) does the opposite of what you describe - it makes the PCs weigh their options and the benefits pitfalls - leads to desperate gambles and crazy plays.

Is that narrow crevasse the PC defending even narrower than 5 feet? Then probably then only person can stand there.

I have very simple ruling for this kind of thing. Can three people stand in a 5 foot square? Yes. Can the three of them fight effectively in that square? Let's say no. So "everyone standing in the same square" is the kind of silly assumption of bending the # of people in a square rule. Apply what makes sense to what is being described and run with it.

 

[Maxperson]

I don't allow attacking from an ally's square. It leads to all sorts of potential abuse.

Ultimately, if you can attack from someone else's space, in effect doing anything except end your turn, what exactly is the point of having a space in the first place? PCs being in and doing things from their own space is a fundamental assumption of the grid-based rules.

Yep. Stick the hard to hit PC in the doorway to keep the enemy penned inside and then everyone else can round robin their attacks, stepping into the doorway blocker's space to attack and then leave. MAYBE, depending on position, one of you provokes an opportunity attack, but then the reaction of the NPC is spent and everyone else is safe.