BAB + Int mod?

[olshanski]

Have you considered it might be

1d20+Int Modifier+Spell level+Feats (spell focus) vs a static Will defense?

or

1d20+Int Modifier+1/2 Caster Level+Feats vs a static Will defense?

 

[erf_beto]

Have you considered it might be

1d20+Int Modifier+Spell level+Feats (spell focus) vs a static Will defense?

or

1d20+Int Modifier+1/2 Caster Level+Feats vs a static Will defense?

You mean,

Melee Attack Bonus  = 1/2 level + class bonus + STR bonus + feats
Ranged Attack Bonus = 1/2 level + class bonus + DEX bonus + feats
Magic Attack Bonus  = 1/2 level + class bonus + INT bonus + feats

roll d20:
+Melee Attack  vs Armor Class
+Ranged Attack vs Reflex Save
+Magic Attack  vs AC/Ref/Fort/Will (spell dependent)

sounds a bit like my homebrew d20 that never gets done...

 

[Aage]

Yeah, probably something like that... Though I don't care to much for the "class bonus" idea, at least not if done like in Saga... It always bothered me that a wizard 20 and a wizard1/Ranger19 have the same class bonus (or actually, the latter would have even better, since he gets the ranger class bonuses to)... If they do something about that, I'd be all for it

 

[am181d]

Yeah, probably something like that... Though I don't care to much for the "class bonus" idea, at least not if done like in Saga... It always bothered me that a wizard 20 and a wizard1/Ranger19 have the same class bonus (or actually, the latter would have even better, since he gets the ranger class bonuses to)... If they do something about that, I'd be all for it

Let me offer the counter-argument:

Imagine two character, Bob the Apprentice and Azagorn the Bold, a 19th level Ranger.

Bob the Apprentice is (as you would imagine) an apprentice about to select his first character level.

Azagorn the Bold, by contrast, has been adventuring for 13 years. He's saved the world 9 times, slayed the Great Beast of Morthac, mastered the secrets of the Sword of Etheric, etc. Oh, and he's close personal friends with Zeladane, a 19th level Wizard who runs the Wizard's Guild of Tolm.

Bob and Azagorn are both picking up their first level of Wizard. They both gain access to X number of 1st level Wizard spells, including (let's say) Magic Missile.

Obviously Bob is going to cast Magic Missile as a 1st level Wizard. But I have *zero* problem with Azagorn casting as a 20th level character. Azagorn is, after all, a bad-ass.

This is clearly the most balanced way to handle multi-classing, and it makes sense from a story stand point as well. And, for anyone who's worried that Azagorn is suddenly "as powerful" as a 20th level Wizard, rememeber that Zeladane the Great can still roll his eyes at Azagorn and say, "That's wonderful Azagorn. You've mastered a spell designed for children. Let me know when you've figured out how to stop time."

 

[Aage]

Let me offer the counter-argument:

Imagine two character, Bob the Apprentice and Azagorn the Bold, a 19th level Ranger.

Bob the Apprentice is (as you would imagine) an apprentice about to select his first character level.

Azagorn the Bold, by contrast, has been adventuring for 13 years. He's saved the world 9 times, slayed the Great Beast of Morthac, mastered the secrets of the Sword of Etheric, etc. Oh, and he's close personal friends with Zeladane, a 19th level Wizard who runs the Wizard's Guild of Tolm.

Bob and Azagorn are both picking up their first level of Wizard. They both gain access to X number of 1st level Wizard spells, including (let's say) Magic Missile.

Obviously Bob is going to cast Magic Missile as a 1st level Wizard. But I have *zero* problem with Azagorn casting as a 20th level character. Azagorn is, after all, a bad-ass.

This is clearly the most balanced way to handle multi-classing, and it makes sense from a story stand point as well. And, for anyone who's worried that Azagorn is suddenly "as powerful" as a 20th level Wizard, rememeber that Zeladane the Great can still roll his eyes at Azagorn and say, "That's wonderful Azagorn. You've mastered a spell designed for children. Let me know when you've figured out how to stop time."

I couldn't agree more, that wasn't what I was complaining about. What I did have an issue with is the class bonus idea from Saga edition star wars, which all classes gain at 1st level to their saves. If they multiclass, they may pick the best bonus from each of their classes, which mean that a wizard 19/ranger 1 gains better save bonuses than a wizard 20. Now, if this bonus is applied to magic attack/base attack as well, this would mean that a Rogue19/Fighter1 would have the same BAB as a Fighter20... that's what grinds my gears

 

[erf_beto]

I couldn't agree more, that wasn't what I was complaining about. What I did have an issue with is the class bonus idea from Saga edition star wars, which all classes gain at 1st level to their saves. If they multiclass, they may pick the best bonus from each of their classes, which mean that a wizard 19/ranger 1 gains better save bonuses than a wizard 20. Now, if this bonus is applied to magic attack/base attack as well, this would mean that a Rogue19/Fighter1 would have the same BAB as a Fighter20... that's what grinds my gears

As long as the Class Bonuses scale with level within said class, I'm ok with it: so if a Wizard starts with a crappy bonus to [whatever], he could multiclass into Ranger to get a better bonus, but if he sticks with wizardry, by the time he gets to level 19th his bonus will be so much better than that of a 1st level ranger, that he won't even considering multiclassing for that matter. The same with the Rogue/Fighter: as a first level fighter, his BAB class bonus would be something like +5, but as a 19th level Rogue, it would be +15 - so when you pick the better one (15), that begginer level of fighter had no effect in teaching the experienced rogue on how to fight.
Of course, lots of worms can come out of this can. Needs TLC...

 

[Gort]

This is clearly the most balanced way to handle multi-classing, and it makes sense from a story stand point as well. And, for anyone who's worried that Azagorn is suddenly "as powerful" as a 20th level Wizard, rememeber that Zeladane the Great can still roll his eyes at Azagorn and say, "That's wonderful Azagorn. You've mastered a spell designed for children. Let me know when you've figured out how to stop time."

I don't mind this either, except when it comes to spells that scale inappropriately well, like ray of enfeeblement. Azagorn would be pretty deadly casting that at the start of fights.