Battle Mage (custom)

[borble]

Cool, I hope you like it. It's kind of the opposite to yours, in that you have limited spells in your repertoire (though you can get them from anywhere), but can cast them often. Indeed, you can pretty much cast them all day long if you want (so long as you keep refreshing your dweomers). It makes for a more tightly focused caster.

Re: d8. I thought it might be beneficial to have a higher hit die, since they supposed to be tough. I was wavering on leaving it as d6, so feel free to if you want.

re: Your skill list.



Ouch, capital letters!

I thought about including Balance and Tumble as well, but didn't, since I didn't want to give the class too much flexibility. This is supposed to be a class extremely focused on spells, remember?


removed, for they have the skill thingy


Knowledge (nature): sure I can see that, given your fluff on the natural world.


cool


Listen, Spot, Search: Why these? This class doesn't sound like a scout or woodsman type.


removed


Decipher Script and Forgery: Given your Craft restriction (that is, old battle stuff), these two seem like awful strange skill to include. They have nothing to do with battle.


removed


Heal: Yeah, ok. Field healing.





Gather Information, Sense Motive: Battle mages don't exactly seem to social type either.


good point


Use Magic Device: Hmm, when I was comparing my own version with the Warlock, I thought about including it. I decided not to, concluding that they were strong enough on their own. They don't really have enough skill points in the first place to really focus on this anyway.


it fine


and finally, Re: 9th-level spells by 13th level

The other posters who have commented on this have a point. You should really reconsidere your point of view regarding this. Why are you so set on having such early access to spells? 13th level is, in my mind, far too early to get access to such powerful spells due, as monboesen mentioned, to a number of non-scaling spells you would have access to.

As for the Battle Sorcerer, here's a link to the SRD. Rage Mage is a prestige class found in Complete Warrior, page 72.

im fixing the charts

 

[borble]

fixed the charts
ben

 

[Sound of Azure]

fixed the charts
ben

Great! That's a lot better .

I think it works fairly well, I think unless you get more auras (that can be poetically useful) I think you should remove endrich aura’s (sic) (although I like the concept).

The Eldritch Auras are an ability that is meant to be useful at all times, not just in battle (like their dweomers). They can also give a reason for other people to actually want a battle mage around. Part of being a good team member is being able to aid your allies.

Poetically useful?

I also didn't give the class too many auras so that they don't step on the toes of aura-based classes like the Dragon Shaman or Marshall, or buff classes like the Bard.

Also your bonus feats don’t seem useful,...

The feats were chosen so that they would not be overpowering. Some are for making the battle mage tougher (toughness, improved toughness, endurance, diehard), improve his magical abilities (the "metamagic" feats), or improve his defence (armour and shield proficiencies). These free up the character's normal feats for other purposes.

and so I will show you my revisions on your perception of my class .

Ok. I'll just go through the things you changed.

Dweomers Readied: You can ready all three of your dweomers you know at 1st level, but as you advance in level and learn more dweomers, you must choose which dweomers to ready. You can ready an number of deweomers equal your con mod + 3 (if you have that many dweomers).

Like the martial adept classes (Crusader, Swordsage, and Warblade), I designed the battle mage so that it did not gain bonus readied spells from a high modifier. It's a different system to regular spell-casting. Allowing a direct bonus based on constitution is a mistake in my opinion.

Why, you ask? Since these powers are almost at will (you just need to renew your expended dweomers to use them again), there needs to be some checks and balances. One of these checks is a low amount of known powers. The other is the low amount of powers you have available at any one time. Initially, your known and readied powers is the same, but over time there is a disparity. This encourages the player to think a little, and adapt with circumstances.

Adding the key casting stat to the number of readied dweomers closes the potential gap at higher levels, reducing the opportunity cost of readying the "wrong" dweomers.

You begin an encounter with all your readied dweomers unexpended, regardless of how many times you might have already used them since you chose them. You can use a deweomer once before it is expended. When you expend a dweomer, it is used up for the current encounter (unless you recover them, as described below).

Not a bad clarification in the middle.

Other wise they respond in a number of rounds equal to the spell lolls you expended after battle (I.E. a first level battle mage who casts 3 first level spells, has to wait 3 rounds after battle for his dweomers to recharge).

Unnecessary, since dweomers are automatically ready for use at the beginning of each encounter. A 20th-level battle mage only takes 7 rounds to refresh all expended dweomers anyway, no matter the level, in the case of an extended or consecutive encounter.

Eldritch Auras (Su):
<snip>

Alacrity: dodge bonus to AC against attacks of opportunity and bonus on reflex saves equal to your aura bonus. At level 10 this adds to all ac.

I left it as only against attacks of opportunity, since it will help promote movement on the battlefield, and also allow characters to take riskier actions in combat.

Having the dodge bonus apply at all times would probably be a good upgrade to the aura (see below)

Awareness: bonus on Listen and Spot checks, as well as on initiative checks, equal to your aura bonus. At level 10 this bonus doubles.

Initiative bonuses are very strong, especially as you're aiding the whole party. Potential upgrade would be to allow those within the aura to make free action listen/spot checks each round, instead of requiring a move action.

Endurance: bonus on concentration checks and on fortitude saves against exhaustion and fatigue equal to your aura bonus. At level 10 it helps all fortitude saves.

I can see some potential there, though it's not meant to be a blanket bonus. It's meant to keep forces on their feet, and also to help mages cast their spells amidst a battle.

Power: bonus on melee damage rolls equal to your aura bonus. At level 10 this bonus affects attack rolls also.

I try to avoid giving out constant untyped bonuses to attack rolls, since it will cause stacking issues with bards and marshalls. Damage is pretty strong on its own, and may mean the difference between getting through damage reduction/hardness or not.

Stability: bonus on opposed strength checks against bull rush and trip attempts equal to your aura bonus. At level 10 this aids rolls meant to heal someone under 0 hp with bonuses equal to your aura bonus.

How are these related? If you want to keep something like this, how about giving a bonus equal to 5x your Aura bonus on checks to stabilise when you are at negative hit points.

Toughness: DR 1/Cold Iron for each point of your aura bonus. At level 10 this changes to DR1/-.

Interesting. Sounds like it would make a good feat to expand the power of this aura (see bottom of post).

Valor: Bonus on will saves against fear and compulsions. At level 10 this adds all will saves.

I restricted it since it was intended to be a morale-like effect (for solidarity).

---
Note I didn't add extra abilities to the auras since they already scale. I didn't allow the battle mage the ability to take all of the auras, so that the player needs to really think about which ones to pick as they advance in level.

However, you should have the option of taking more Auras if you really want to.

Awaken Aura
You awaken the power of a new Eldritch Aura.
Prerequisites: 2 Eldritch Auras known, Knowledge (arcana) 10 ranks.
Benefit: You may add one Eldritch Aura from the list of battle mage Eldritch Auras to your Auras known. This Aura is now available for use when you raise an Eldritch Aura.
Special: You can select this feat more than once. Each time you select it, you add another Eldritch Aura to you list of Auras Known.

Sudden Recovery
You can instantly refresh your reserves of power after casting a dweomer.
Prerequisite: 5 known dweomers
Benefit: Once per day as a swift action, you can instantly refresh an expended dweomer. In is now ready again.

Extra Readied Dweomer
Prerequisite: Battle mage level 3+
Benefit: Increase the number of dweomers you can ready for your battle mage levels by one.
Special: You can take this feat only once.

Eldritch Vitality
Your arcane might allows you to catch a second wind when you take stock and recover your dweomers.
Prerequisite: 3 dweomers known, Knowledge (arcana 5 ranks)
Benefit: When you recover one or more expended dweomers, you heal 3 points of damage + 1 point per character level. You can gain this benefit only once per encounter.

And potentially:-

Empower Eldritch Aura
You have forged a stronger connection to your nexus of arcane power. One of your Eldritch Auras gains a secondary effect.
Prerequisites: Ability to raise Eldritch Auras, Wisdom 15+, Caster level 9+, Knowledge (arcana) 12 ranks
Benefit: Choose one of your Auras Known. This Aura gains a secondary effect whenever you raise it.
<effects detailed in borble's post>
Special: You may choose this feat more than once. Each time you select it, it applies to another of your Eldritch Auras known.

 

[jasin]

It's kind of the opposite to yours, in that you have limited spells in your repertoire (though you can get them from anywhere), but can cast them often. Indeed, you can pretty much cast them all day long if you want (so long as you keep refreshing your dweomers). It makes for a more tightly focused caster.

I don't think this is a good idea.

It works for ToB classes and the warlock because combat abilities at will are still inherently limited by how much time you spend in combat, and non-combat warlock abilities (like the one that gives bonuses to social skills) are specifically written up for the warlock.

Utility or longer lasting defensive spells (which are written with the assumption that they are a depletable resource) usable at will can really put things out of whack.

A battle mage with death ward means the whole party will forevermore be immune to negative energy.

A battle mage with protection from energy means the whole party will forever more be immune to all energy.

A battle mage with clairaudience/clairvoyance means you can automatically give him the map of every part of the dungeon within 400 ft. + 40 ft./level.

Even these are perhaps not insurmountable balance problems, but they would definitely change the way the game plays.

I think a warrior-spellcaster who uses spells at will would work much better if limited to instantaneous stuff and defensive abilities limited along the lines of the swift versions of PHB spells (swift invisibility, swift fly): swift action to activate, lasts for 1 round. Probably not even all of those; I'm sure there are instantaneous spells that can get really silly if they're available at will...

 

[Sound of Azure]

I think that's a good point. It's the reason I went with the Warblade numbers rather than, say, the Swordsage numbers. Choosing defensive spells like Death Ward or protection from energy is an opportunity cost.

It might be a good idea to have all spell effects teminate at the end of battle, regardless of duration.

In the end, I agree it would be much better to devise a specific spell list that a battle mage could choose from. Or to devise "schools" so that it cleaves even closer to the ToB model.

In part, I was too lasy to do so earlier, and I also wanted to retain a portion of borble's desired flexibility. First draft blues, y'know?

Anyhow, back to the drawing board so I can design a true class spell list.

 

[borble]

i was just giving you food for thought.
my first version works for me.

i think we can change it to instant spells (in my world all spells are instant lol).
thanks all
ben

 

[Sound of Azure]

i think we can change it to instant spells (in my world all spells are instant lol).

Could you explain what you mean by "instant"? As in quickened (a swift action), or something else?

 

[jasin]

Choosing defensive spells like Death Ward or protection from energy is an opportunity cost.

OK, but the costs and benefits change from the baseline established for slots-per-day casters.

For example, with very few spells known but usable at will, protection from energy is probably a better spell than death ward, because it lets you be immune to all energy all the time as oppose to just be immune to negative energy all the time.

For a regular caster, it takes five 3rd-level slots for that, as opposed to just one 4rd-level slot for death ward, and protection from energy gets used up (much less of an issue when you've got an unlimited amount of them).

So for a caster like this, protection from energy might well be higher level than death ward.

Of course, it'd be better yet if they had access to just spells which were appropriate. I like my swift idea: the at-will caster uses spell much like a fighter uses a sword. Rather than casting protection from fire to prepare himself for a fireball, he "parries" with it by putting it up as he gets hit, but it's gone immediately after. (Obviously, this would actually require an immediate action, not swift...)

It might be a good idea to have all spell effects teminate at the end of battle, regardless of duration.

That would take care of it, but I think that's a terribly artificial distinction. The crusader's healing strikes are about as much as I can take.

In the end, I agree it would be much better to devise a specific spell list that a battle mage could choose from. Or to devise "schools" so that it cleaves even closer to the ToB model.

In part, I was too lasy to do so earlier, and I also wanted to retain a portion of borble's desired flexibility. First draft blues, y'know?

Sure. Just voicin' my thoughts.

 

[borble]

standard action.
ben