D&D 3E/3.5 Beating 3.5 Psionics with the nerf bat

[Arkhandus]

Original 3e handbook? Isn't that a bit of a contradiction?

I still want to set everything back to sciences and disciplines, but that's just me.

Hear hear!

I much preferred the old version of psionics, and would've liked to see 3E update it with just better balance and more powers to learn. It was more interesting and unique when psionics was more like a tiered feat-tree/skill-check type system, and it made more sense thematically with how powers were developed/discovered by the psionicist.

'Course, I'd also prefer psionics to be Core again, like they were in 1E.....

 

[Gisori]

There is one problem with not allow psionic characters to augment their powers the powers do not self scale like spells do.

If you are using that first house rule it would be like saying to a 8th level wizard that if you cast fireball you can use 6d6 as a standard casting but if you want to use your full 8d6 then you will have to spend a full round casting and some of your feats won't work or can't be used until you take a standard action (move with a feat) to refocus.

 

[irdeggman]

Problem 3: No psion ever learns Detect Psionics

Psions and Wilders get the Detect Psionics power for free.

Why have this if you think that psions are too powerful in your game?

You've just given them a free power.

Sorcerers must choose detect magic as one of their "known" spells just like psions must choose detect psionics as one of theirs. This effectively reduces the powers they can know (that would allow them to go nova) by 1 st level power. There are no 0-level powers.


I think that in a game where there is very few encounters per day (like yours) any spontanous casters (or a manifester) have a huge advantage in the first place. Nerfing on (psions) and not the other is really not that fair.

You should pay a lot of attention to the psionic focus and how much time it takes for the psion to recover it. This is one of the big limiting factors for psions and a lot of people sem to overlook it.

 

[Felnar]

Problem 1: Psions going nova

If a power is augmented to more than half the manifester's level, the powers manifesting time is increased to at least a full round action (using the same guidelines as for sorcerers using metamagic) and expends psionic focus. The manifester can use the focus for a metapsionic feat used on the same power if desired, and using quicken power supercedes the manifesting time extension.

i would guess only giving half pp's would work great with your half recommended encounters

do you also limit mage nova'ing ability?

Problem 2: 1 power = An energy type for every occasion

When learning a power which allows the choice of one of the 4 energy types when manifested, this choice must be made when the power is learned instead. A psionics user with powers of only one energy type gets +1 manifester level with those powers.

how about this:
when a manifester first learns an energy power they select 1(or 2?) energy type as being available, the other 3 are not, the energy types chosen apply to all powers learned in the future

then make a feat that grants another energy type (which can be taken mulitple times)

 

[DreamChaser]

I have removed my post to D&D rules and out of this thread as per a mods indirect suggestion. I do not accept the initial premise and thus my comments had no place here.

My response has moved here: http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=203629

Sorry about that!

DC

 

[Piratecat]

Everyone, please read this:

This isn't a thread for debating whether psionics are overpowered. Here in House Rules, it's a thread that posits that they are, and is trying to find ways to reduce their power. If the thread is on topic, that's the only thing that should be discussed.

Please don't post in this thread if you just want to wrangle over the "are they/aren't they" question. Certainly do post if you are willing to accept the initial premise and have creative solutions or cool ideas to adjust them, of course.

Thanks!

 

[WhatGravitas]

IProblem 2: 1 power = An energy type for every occasion

Hmm... most psions are somewhat power-starved, so I don't really like this, so what about this:

1) When a psion selects an energy power, he chooses his 'main energy type' for that power, using a different energy type, than the primary one, costs one or two additional power points as augment.

2) Bonus powers: The energy powers are split up into several powers, one for each energy. For each three powers with the same energy type, he gets another power of his choice - this rewards themed psions and compensates a bit for the more restrictive power selection.

 

[Baby Samurai]

'Course, I'd also prefer psionics to be Core again, like they were in 1E.....

You mean all of that compare Attack Mode C to Defence Mode K action?

…Noooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[irdeggman]

Hmm... most psions are somewhat power-starved, so I don't really like this, so what about this:

1) When a psion selects an energy power, he chooses his 'main energy type' for that power, using a different energy type, than the primary one, costs one or two additional power points as augment.

This seems like a novel concept.

It functions a lot like class and cross class skills. In fact I'd recommend handling it exaclty like skills. That is for energy types that aren't "main" then the augmentation cost is double that of the "main" type. Keeps the booking (and concept) simplier.

 

[Arkhandus]

I never said I wanted it to be directly translated to 3E with no changes......just that I liked the old version of psionics better.

The attack/defense mode comparison could be simplified y'know, and it wasn't necessarily bad in and of itself, just quirky..... And of course it'd need to be tweaked such that being psionic wasn't just a weakness in psionic combat.... That bit in 3.0 psionics is annoying.

I really gotta get back to work sometime on my 3E version of the 2E Psionicist.


Main problem with my project was that I broke up sciences and devotions just a bit into 2 tiers each, with Lesser and Greater devotions, Psychic Sciences and Ultra Sciences (yeah, cheesy name I know; another, more minor problem is that I sometimes like silly old-comic-bookery type stuff). My feats for wild talents were also probably too potent despite the drawback of needing difficult skill checks to make any wild talent powers function.

And I think I took my conversion of the Ballistic Attack devotion too far....got too complicated and detailed. I also had made part of the Psionicist's mechanics a bit too complicated. So I didn't get started on many powers before deciding that I had probably over-complicated things that time.

Class snippet in spoiler block (and a note, my version included a new attack mode and a new defense mode, which is why the class learns 12 combat modes over time).
[sblock=Psionicist]PSIONICIST
Alignment: Any lawful.
Hit Dice: d6.

Class Skills
The psionicist's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Autohypnosis (Wis, exclusive skill), Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Harness Subconscious (Int, new exclusive skill), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (all skills, taken individually) (Int), Meditative Focus (Wis, new exclusive skill), Perform (Cha), Psicraft (Int), Rejuvenate Psyche (Con, new exclusive skill), Remote View (Int, exclusive skill), Sense Motive (Wis), Stabilize Self (Con, exclusive skill), and Use Psionic Device (Cha, exclusive skill).
Skill Points At 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) x 4
Skill Points At Each Additional Level: 4 + Int modifier.

Weapon And Armor Proficiencies: Psionicists are proficient with the club, composite shortbow, dagger, halfspear, handaxe, hand crossbow, light crossbow, light hammer, light mace, light pick, punching dagger, scimitar, shortbow, shortspear, short sword, and throwing axe, and with all light armors.

[B]Class	Base		Fort	Ref 	Will
Level	Attack		Save	Save	Save	Special[/B]
1	+0		+0	+0	+2	Two Psionic Combat Modes, Two Bonus Feats
2	+1		+0	+0	+3	Psionic Combat Mode
3	+1		+1	+1	+3	Psionic Combat Mode
4	+2		+1	+1	+4	Psionic Combat Mode
5	+2		+1	+1	+4
6	+3		+2	+2	+5	Bonus Feat
7	+3		+2	+2	+5	Psionic Combat Mode
8	+4		+2	+2	+6	Psionic Combat Mode
9	+4		+3	+3	+6
10	+5		+3	+3	+7	Psionic Combat Mode
11	+5		+3	+3	+7	Psionic Combat Mode
12	+6/+1		+4	+4	+8	Bonus Feat
13	+6/+1		+4	+4	+8
14	+7/+2		+4	+4	+9	Psionic Combat Mode
15	+7/+2		+5	+5	+9	Psionic Combat Mode
16	+8/+3		+5	+5	+10	Psionic Combat Mode
17	+8/+3		+5	+5	+10
18	+9/+4		+6	+6	+11	Bonus Feat
19	+9/+4		+6	+6	+11	Enhanced Combat Mode
20	+10/+5		+6	+6	+12	Enhanced Combat Mode

[/sblock]