diaglo
Adventurer
check out this thread: http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=108218
Beware!!! Beholders a Head
- Thread starter Harmon
- Start date
diaglo said:
Thanks. Situation is fairly similar.
I did not jump into your Story Hour to find out how it turned out (time is limited), hope all went well?
I am fairly certain that the Beholder will have lots of friends, we entered the cave following Orcs so that might be the enemy we face. Sunrods will be used (I use them like modern day light sticks- light and toss), so light shouldn’t be a problem- unless the GM gets mean on us again.
It will be the 19th before we get back to this, again- thank you all for your help, please keep ideas flowing who know who you might be helping.
Treebore
First Post
Harmon,
I am expecting a highly domed cavern with lots of stalactites (read: cover) AND multiple beholders, I am guessing the "babies" are a foreshadowing of the real encounter. I also agree with you that the Orcs work for/with the Beholder(s). So we are in for a very tough fight and we better fight smart and be willing to retreat when it starts getting ugly.
What is the effect of the anti-magic ray on creatures already summoned? I haven't read the spell description because it isn't on my (druid) spell list.
As for what I am planning on doing: casting Stone Skin and Deathward and Greater Magic Fang on myself and attack as my favored Dire Lion form. I'll know when I am in the Anti-magic area. I'll use my 4th level spells to summon 3 medium air elementals with +4 to STR and CON because of my feats. I'll summon those before we attack, I hope. I would like to be able to fly in my D. Tiger form, but I am guessing I'll be helping by attacking the orcs and other ground bound minions. Plus I also hope to be buffed with Cats Grace, Bull Strength, etc... Just like our other fighters, since my Druid is such an effective combatant.
I am looking at casting a higher level fog effect, but I find those often shaft the party as much as the enemy, unless we are prepared for that as well. Heck, none of us even have the blindfighting feat.
I am expecting a highly domed cavern with lots of stalactites (read: cover) AND multiple beholders, I am guessing the "babies" are a foreshadowing of the real encounter. I also agree with you that the Orcs work for/with the Beholder(s). So we are in for a very tough fight and we better fight smart and be willing to retreat when it starts getting ugly.
What is the effect of the anti-magic ray on creatures already summoned? I haven't read the spell description because it isn't on my (druid) spell list.
As for what I am planning on doing: casting Stone Skin and Deathward and Greater Magic Fang on myself and attack as my favored Dire Lion form. I'll know when I am in the Anti-magic area. I'll use my 4th level spells to summon 3 medium air elementals with +4 to STR and CON because of my feats. I'll summon those before we attack, I hope. I would like to be able to fly in my D. Tiger form, but I am guessing I'll be helping by attacking the orcs and other ground bound minions. Plus I also hope to be buffed with Cats Grace, Bull Strength, etc... Just like our other fighters, since my Druid is such an effective combatant.
I am looking at casting a higher level fog effect, but I find those often shaft the party as much as the enemy, unless we are prepared for that as well. Heck, none of us even have the blindfighting feat.
Arcane Runes Press
First Post
I can't believe no one's popped in to say "Yep, they're pretty much ALL head" yet.
So, consider it done.
Patrick Y.
So, consider it done.
Patrick Y.
azmodean
First Post
One nitpick about an earlier comment, Insanity is instantaneous, so it is not negated by an anti-magic field.
Summoned creatures dissapear when in an anti-magic field, but reappear once the field is gone. The duration of the spell keeps running the entire time though.
You might even want to consider summoning more creatures instead of powerful creatures, I don't think the AC on a dirgible-based monster would be that high. That way you can also surround it with a single casting of the spell (though unfortunately that allows it full use of all the eye rays.)
Grapple, grapple, grapple! Spell-like abilities require concentration checks too! See about summoning your best grappling monster right on top of the thing, at the least it should fail some of the concentration checks. Even better, if you summon something big enough, be sure to remind your DM that a creature can't fly if it is more than lightly encumbered
On the down side, beholders are large 
In my game, I don't consider this metagaming, it's common knowledge: if it's magic, it requires a concentration check. Your mileage may vary.
If you can get it on the ground, ready actions to beat on it if it tries to use any abilities. (if your DM allows you to ready vs a free action, it's kind of iffy)
On the concentration theme, how about acid? Impose some continuing damage concentration checks on it, it's sure to make it fail at least a few times, and each of those times is one less eye ray hitting you or your allies. Also included is any damage dealing spell that has a duration (wall of flame for instance)
Weather effects, such as gust of wind even. I think the druid gets several of these. EDIT: not gust of wind, it does nothing to large creatures, eve if they are flying
HOLY CRAP! I never noticed before that the concentration check DCs no longer add in the spell level. That makes my suggestions marginally less useful, but still, it should make it lose a few rays.
Summoned creatures dissapear when in an anti-magic field, but reappear once the field is gone. The duration of the spell keeps running the entire time though.
You might even want to consider summoning more creatures instead of powerful creatures, I don't think the AC on a dirgible-based monster would be that high. That way you can also surround it with a single casting of the spell (though unfortunately that allows it full use of all the eye rays.)
Grapple, grapple, grapple! Spell-like abilities require concentration checks too! See about summoning your best grappling monster right on top of the thing, at the least it should fail some of the concentration checks. Even better, if you summon something big enough, be sure to remind your DM that a creature can't fly if it is more than lightly encumbered
On the down side, beholders are large In my game, I don't consider this metagaming, it's common knowledge: if it's magic, it requires a concentration check. Your mileage may vary.
If you can get it on the ground, ready actions to beat on it if it tries to use any abilities. (if your DM allows you to ready vs a free action, it's kind of iffy)
On the concentration theme, how about acid? Impose some continuing damage concentration checks on it, it's sure to make it fail at least a few times, and each of those times is one less eye ray hitting you or your allies. Also included is any damage dealing spell that has a duration (wall of flame for instance)
Weather effects, such as gust of wind even. I think the druid gets several of these. EDIT: not gust of wind, it does nothing to large creatures, eve if they are flying
HOLY CRAP! I never noticed before that the concentration check DCs no longer add in the spell level. That makes my suggestions marginally less useful, but still, it should make it lose a few rays.
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So many people get suggesting the grapple thing and I keep going over the PCs that would be good at the grapple and I keep coming back to Treebore's Druid. Question- (the druid so likes the Dire Kitten form of a Lion, but he is not restricted to that)- what form do you all think I should ask him to assume if he can get into grapple range, it should be something Large plus-ish and have some kind of real grappling ability.
It occures to me that an invisible Dire Lion flying up and over the Beholder and dropping on it- commiting to the grapple more then anything else would have a serious damping effect on the Beholders flight ability, however that seems to restrict the chances that one of our most leathal combatants can do much more then focus on said Beholder. Would this be consider a good tactic? (FWIW- I think it might be our best bet.)
Again, thanks for the help.
It occures to me that an invisible Dire Lion flying up and over the Beholder and dropping on it- commiting to the grapple more then anything else would have a serious damping effect on the Beholders flight ability, however that seems to restrict the chances that one of our most leathal combatants can do much more then focus on said Beholder. Would this be consider a good tactic? (FWIW- I think it might be our best bet.)
Again, thanks for the help.
Question for rules-gurus: what happens to a Wall of Force when the AM ray is turned on? My understanding is that WoF is not affected, if the wall already exists. If true, then walls of force can be used to both isolate the battlefield, and to cover a hasty retreat. Just a thought.
Harmon said:
A Wall of force is not affected by antimagic. As mentioned, the beholder can disintegrate it, but if that's all it's doing with its disintegrate beam that round, that's fine.
A druid's shapeshifting ability, btw, is affected.
azmodean said:
No, the rays are supernatural abilities, not spell-like. No concentration checks required.
If the beholder has allies (and it should) that is a much stickier wicket. Really, the central eye's primary benefit is preventing players from nuking minions.
I kind of thought the beholder might be alone because the party seems to be a little low in level (mostly 10th, right?) to take on a beholder with minions.
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Ridley's Cohort
First Post
Have the Druid summon some Dire Bats. A SNA IV will give you d4+1 Dire Bats.
Blindness and Glitterdust can really ruin the Beholder's day. Consider having some Fog Clouds and Webs handy. You have more buffing & healing power than the Beholder -- slowing the combat down will favor the party.
Keep grouped together. Do not split apart. He gets more attacks if you scatter.
Blindness and Glitterdust can really ruin the Beholder's day. Consider having some Fog Clouds and Webs handy. You have more buffing & healing power than the Beholder -- slowing the combat down will favor the party.
Keep grouped together. Do not split apart. He gets more attacks if you scatter.
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