D&D 4E Bioware working on 4e Forgotten Realms MMO

[JVisgaitis]

With D&D out of the picture, I think its Star Wars. Here's a new article on Gamespot where they are surmising its Kotor.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Going up against Warhammer Online isn't keeping most investors up at night. Lord of the Rings was likely the one they were sweating over (wrongly, as it turns out, since it's a success but hardly a juggernaut).

Yeah, KotOR has a really good chance of being a WoW-sized hit. Star Wars, done well, by a development house that's got a proven track record with the license, and two games that, even if they aren't perfect, are pretty much beloved by most Star Wars fans and CRPGers.

If they're investing in any MMORPG which takes any pride whatsoever in it's PvP, WAR should be keeping them up at night. Design, investment and hype-wise, it's definately the next big fantasy MMORPG, I'd suggest. It won't be WoW big, because nothing will be for years, but it's got a bigger potential audience, and much smarter developers than LotRO, as well as great potential to provoke loyalty.

KotOR is just such a good idea that I will be really surprised if it isn't it. Legacy, as some others have proposed has the merit of featuring the post-Empire and more recognizable vehicles etc. - but it has major demerits in terms of having to be far more careful as to what you do with the IP, and being set "after the war". Then again, WoW is set "after the war", so maybe, done right, that's not so much of a demerit.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

If they're investing in any MMORPG which takes any pride whatsoever in it's PvP, WAR should be keeping them up at night. Design, investment and hype-wise, it's definately the next big fantasy MMORPG, I'd suggest. It won't be WoW big, because nothing will be for years, but it's got a bigger potential audience, and much smarter developers than LotRO, as well as great potential to provoke loyalty.

Warhammer may be HUGE in the UK (I don't know, myself), but it simply is flat-out unknown to most American consumers.

It's not a big fantasy MMORPG right out of the gate internationally. It may build, over time, as EverQuest did, depending on word of mouth.

Then again, WoW is set "after the war", so maybe, done right, that's not so much of a demerit.

Well, WoW is just a pause between wars. I feel pretty confident that once SC2 and (the as yet unannounced) D3 are out the door, we'll see Warcraft IV announced, and set a decade or more in the future of WoW. Which then, of course, will set up the new status quo for WoW2 after that.

 

[The Little Raven]

If they're investing in any MMORPG which takes any pride whatsoever in it's PvP, WAR should be keeping them up at night. Design, investment and hype-wise, it's definately the next big fantasy MMORPG, I'd suggest.

Honestly, it's PvP isn't anything special. It has the same mechanics as WoW (target selection, auto-attack, cooldowns, weapon speeds, tick-based regeneration, resource management) with the exception of collision detection between enemy units.

It won't be WoW big, because nothing will be for years, but it's got a bigger potential audience, and much smarter developers than LotRO, as well as great potential to provoke loyalty.

We'll see. The reason WoW succeeded is that it didn't target the hardcore gamer, like WAR is doing. It targeted people who just wanted to take a break in a fantasy world for a while, and you can play as little or as much as you want.

KotOR is just such a good idea that I will be really surprised if it isn't it. Legacy, as some others have proposed has the merit of featuring the post-Empire and more recognizable vehicles etc. - but it has major demerits in terms of having to be far more careful as to what you do with the IP, and being set "after the war".

The number one reason KotOR is a good idea: the availability of Jedi characters. While many hardcore SWG fans will claim that following the exploits of moisture farmers is totally awesome, the majority of potential customers want to play Star Wars games for that awesome action. Jedi are the number one icon of the setting, and making it a trial to be able to simply unlock the chance to play one will turn off a whole lot of potential players. However, it wasn't entirely SoE's fault, since LucasArts required it set during the Original Trilogy and SoE had to work something in to limit Jedi.

Then again, WoW is set "after the war", so maybe, done right, that's not so much of a demerit.

WoW's more of a cold war. The Horde and Alliance avoid direct confrontation, but still fight through intermediaries (players and allied factions, such as the Battlegrounds).

 

[The Merciful]

Warhammer may be HUGE in the UK (I don't know, myself), but it simply is flat-out unknown to most American consumers.

It's not a big fantasy MMORPG right out of the gate internationally. It may build, over time, as EverQuest did, depending on word of mouth.

Replace "UK" with "Europe", to get better idea. Heck, when I go by groceries, I see White Dwarf in the magazine stand. (WotC, take a hint )

 

[Darth Shoju]

This seems topical:

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic

 

[CrusaderX]

The KOTOR MMORPG rumors keep getting stronger...

SAN FRANCISCO, CA and EDMONTON, CANADA — October 30, 2007 — LucasArts and BioWare Corp. today announced that they have entered into an agreement to create an interactive entertainment product. The product, details of which will be unveiled at a later date, will be developed and published by BioWare and LucasArts, and will push the boundaries of the gaming market by utilizing the strengths of both companies to deliver an innovative, high-quality experience.

http://www.lucasartsbioware.com/

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Warhammer may be HUGE in the UK (I don't know, myself), but it simply is flat-out unknown to most American consumers.

It's not a big fantasy MMORPG right out of the gate internationally. It may build, over time, as EverQuest did, depending on word of mouth.

Well, WoW is just a pause between wars. I feel pretty confident that once SC2 and (the as yet unannounced) D3 are out the door, we'll see Warcraft IV announced, and set a decade or more in the future of WoW. Which then, of course, will set up the new status quo for WoW2 after that.

Warhammer itself isn't huge, but then you over-estimate how huge Warcraft was, I suspect. Warcraft was by no means, say, "Diablo 2" huge. The average American consumer, pre-WoW, had heard of neither Warhammer or Warcraft. Only "gamers" had heard of either, typically.

If you read the official WoW boards (and god help you if you do), you will see a very high level of awareness of WAR amongst WoW players (who themselves regularly refer to WoW as "Waiting on Warhammer"). They may not know or care about the Warhammer universe, but they do know about Warhammer online and how it might be a big deal. On MMORPG.com it's usually at the top of the hype-meter.

Let me be explicit - WAR will not be successful because Warhammer Fantasy Battle is successful. If it was relying of WHFB fans, it'd be a flop. It will be successful because it is a well-designed, casual-friendly "WoW clone" (in the best sense) with superior RvR/PvP design on all levels (from accessibility to long-term play - just like WoW has superior PvE design to previous games), and it has the "marketing oomph" of Electronic Arts behind it, which is not insignificant.

As for D3, well, we can hope Certainly Project Medusa is probably either D3 or WoW2. Blizzard's CEO has specifically stated that when his designers say that they've gone "as far as they can go" with WoW, they will make WoW2. He made no mention of inserting a WC4 in-between, and indeed, I doubt that'd happen, personally.

Mourn - Wow, you're really deeply confused about WAR despite knowing some things, aren't you?

First off you "knock"(?) WAR for having similar mechanics to WoW and claim that it's PvP is thus similar to WoW (it ain't, in the least), then you claim WAR is appealling to a "hardcore" market (it isn't and this point is contradictory to the first). You're right on the mechanics, and horribly confused on the rest. WAR's entire PvP setup is different to WoW, with RvR (side-based PvP) encouraged, yet "griefing"-type play utterly impossible (rather than extremely easy, as it is in WoW). The whole setup has learnt from WoW in the way WoW learnt from other MMOs. It's designed to MORE CASUAL-FRIENDLY than WoW, so claiming otherwise seems a little mind-bending. The designers have gone on about how it's a "spend a little or a lot of time" kind of game, and without endgame raiding, and with some revolutionary functionality like Public Quests, there's literally no possible way to argue WAR, as described, is less casual-friendly than WoW. None. Like I said though, it won't get WoW numbers, but if it doesn't get good numbers, I will be very surprised.

On the other hand, I completely agree about KotOR.

Looks like current evidence only further supports KotOR-related rumours, of course.

 

[JVisgaitis]

The KOTOR MMORPG rumors keep getting stronger...

http://www.lucasartsbioware.com/

If it isn't a Star Wars MMO, I feel that they are intentionally leading people astray...

 

[The Little Raven]

Warhammer itself isn't huge, but then you over-estimate how huge Warcraft was, I suspect. Warcraft was by no means, say, "Diablo 2" huge.

Warcraft 3 outsold Diablo 2.

Diablo 2 set a sales record in 2000, by selling 1 million copies in 1 week. By the six-month mark, it had sold 2.75 million copies.

Warcraft 3, on the other hand, sold 4.5 million preorders, and another million in the month that followed. Warcraft 3 alone pushed the Warcraft franchise ahead of the Diablo franchise, since Warcraft 1 and 2 didn't sell nearly as well as any of them.

If you read the official WoW boards (and god help you if you do), you will see a very high level of awareness of WAR amongst WoW players (who themselves regularly refer to WoW as "Waiting on Warhammer"). They may not know or care about the Warhammer universe, but they do know about Warhammer online and how it might be a big deal. On MMORPG.com it's usually at the top of the hype-meter.

This means nothing. The same crowd harped out City of Villains would kill WoW, how Vanguard would smash it, and how Guild Wars would suck away all the PvPers. None of those games came even close to what these people predicted, and I guarantee that their predictions for Warhammer are equally wrong.

It will be successful because it is a well-designed, casual-friendly "WoW clone" (in the best sense) with superior RvR/PvP design on all levels (from accessibility to long-term play - just like WoW has superior PvE design to previous games), and it has the "marketing oomph" of Electronic Arts behind it, which is not insignificant.

WAR is not casual-friendly. It's designed for more hardcore players, which the developers have made clear in their podcasts and interviews.

As for superior PvP design... not really... the only thing that differentiates from WoW, in terms of PvP mechanics, is collision detection.

First off you "knock"(?) WAR for having similar mechanics to WoW and claim that it's PvP is thus similar to WoW (it ain't, in the least),

I didn't knock it. I pointed out that the claims of revolutionary PvP gameplay are seriously overhyped. It has the same basic combat system, composed of the same elements. It isn't a real-time system, it doesn't use per-pixel targeting, it doesn't require you to do much more than stand still and fight, like WoW.

then you claim WAR is appealling to a "hardcore" market (it isn't and this point is contradictory to the first).

If it isn't appealing to the hardcore market, then why is it all of the "Waiting on Warhammer" people harp on about how it's going to be the hardcore gamers' PvP MMO?

Also... PvP is not what draws most casual gamers, which is why a lot of successful casual games put you in an environment more based around cooperation than competition.

WAR's entire PvP setup is different to WoW, with RvR (side-based PvP) encouraged, yet "griefing"-type play utterly impossible (rather than extremely easy, as it is in WoW). The whole setup has learnt from WoW in the way WoW learnt from other MMOs.

Ummm... not really.

Skirmishes - Random World PvP. No different than PvPing in any open world zone in WoW.
Battlefields - World PvP objectives. No different than fighting over Halaa or the towers in Terokkar Forest.
Scenarios - Instanced PvP objectives + NPCs. Wow, sounds just like a Battleground.
Campaigns - Invading Enemy Lands. This is the only really different thing in this, since WoW allows city raids, but doesn't place any reward on it.

It's designed to MORE CASUAL-FRIENDLY than WoW, so claiming otherwise seems a little mind-bending.

Until the game actually comes out, this statement cannot be fully verified. I played during the early Beta, and it wasn't very casual-friendly. But then again, WoW wasn't very casual friendly at first, either. It's possible, but given the precedent set by Mythic's first PvP game, Dark Age of Camelot, I don't think so.

The designers have gone on about how it's a "spend a little or a lot of time" kind of game, and without endgame raiding, and with some revolutionary functionality like Public Quests, there's literally no possible way to argue WAR, as described, is less casual-friendly than WoW. None. Like I said though, it won't get WoW numbers, but if it doesn't get good numbers, I will be very surprised.

If it was more casual-friendly than WoW, it would beat WoW. WoW won because it provided the most casual-friendly MMO on the market and merged it with a very pleasant and consistent art style. WoW grew the genre in a way that no other game had done. WAR has no indications of growing the market, and plenty of indications of doing what other MMOs do: shuffle around pre-existing MMO players.

And are you honestly saying that there's no way to argue with the hype that the developers are laying on thick? The WAR hype seems to be about as bad as the Daikatana hype was back in the 90s.

On the other hand, I completely agree about KotOR.

Looks like current evidence only further supports KotOR-related rumours, of course.

A KoTOR MMO would probably succeed much more than the original SWG.