Blade Barrier Cheese (135d6 damage)

[MerakSpielman]

Watch out!
It's the speling police!

 

[youspoonybard]

Pinned is not helpless.

You can't CdG a pinned foe.

 

[Hypersmurf]

The simpler way is for the monk to to pin the opponent across the blade barrier. Pinned = helpless and 0 Dex, IIRC.
Just maintain the pin until there's nothing left. Then it's only once per round, no issues, as long as you can win grapple checks.

It depends on your reading of "passing through".

If he gets halfway through and stops, he's only "passing through" once. Until he's gone all the way through and comes back, he isn't "passing through" a second time, so the damage only applies once, even if he's pinned there for the whole duration of the spell.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Pinned is not helpless.

You can't CdG a pinned foe.

But pinned is immobile, which means you don't have room to move.

Under the entry for Evasion in the DMG, it says "As with a Reflex save for any creature, a character must have room to move in order to evade."

So, if you're pinned, and thus immobile, and thus without room to move, you can't use Evasion...

... as with a Reflex save for any creature.

-Hyp.

 

[youspoonybard]

Oddly enough, it says you need room to evade, not the ability to move.

Or is there something else I'm missing?

 

[Philip]

But pinned is immobile, which means you don't have room to move.

Is this true? Is immobile the same as no room to move?

Someone caught in a Web spell (and failing its save) is immobile, would this mean it fails all Reflex saves while still held fast?

Someone affected by hold person has plenty of 'room' to move, but is still immobile.

It seems more like, a creature who is not able to move of his own volition.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Is this true? Is immobile the same as no room to move?

Someone caught in a Web spell (and failing its save) is immobile, would this mean it fails all Reflex saves while still held fast?

Someone affected by hold person has plenty of 'room' to move, but is still immobile.

It seems more like, a creature who is not able to move of his own volition.

One of the examples given is a bound character. He can be bound in the middle of a vast open plain... but he doesn't have "room to move".

If someone's held in a tight tunnel, he cannot move. So let's give him some more room.

Now he's held in a 5' corridor... and he still can't move. Let's give him some more room.

Now he's held in a 20' chamber... and he still can't move. Let's give him some more room.

Now he's held in the middle of a vast open plain... and he stil can't move.

Apparently, for a held character, a vast open plain is not "room to move".

-Hyp.

 

[youspoonybard]

True.

Although I'm not fond of denying characters saves, under virtually any circumstance...

*EDIT*

I hate Heavy Crossbow Rules.

 

[Saeviomagy]

The simpler way is for the monk to to pin the opponent across the blade barrier. Pinned = helpless and 0 Dex, IIRC.

I'd just like to say

BZZT! Wrong.

Pinned characters are most certainly not helpless. If they were, grappling would be by far the most obscenely effective combat tactic in the game.

Pinned characters may not do anything but attempt to break the pin, and others get a +2 to hit them. That's it.

 

[Philip]

Apparently, for a held character, a vast open plain is not "room to move".

-Hyp.

I guess they just phrased it in a weird manner, then.

But do enemies held in a web have 'room to move'. I think we always played that they did. It makes targeting them with those Ref save spells a lot nastier....